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'Stupid,' 'shameful:' Tech workers on Y Combinator CEO Garry Tan's rant

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Re: 'Stupid,' 'shameful:' Tech workers on Y Combinator CEO Garry Tan's rant

#421

Post by Cthulhu_ »

tempestn wrote: post #257

I'm a little bit aghast at all the comments saying this is normal or no big deal. Maybe it is normal (or at least common), but it shouldn't be. If you believe it's no big deal, I can't agree. I can see this kind of behaviour from adolescents, but adults should understand that words are meaningful and have consequences, and that even if you disagree with someone, they're still a human being who deserves some modicum o…

There's a big discussion going on on whether this was good or bad, or whatever, but the point remains that he represents a company, he made a public statement that puts himself in a bad light, which in turn makes the customers of said customer lose trust and respect, which in turn causes the company harm. A lot of harm. And you can't have a CEO that causes the company harm through his public behaviour.

Re: 'Stupid,' 'shameful:' Tech workers on Y Combinator CEO Garry Tan's rant

#422

Post by Amezarak »

Cthulhu_ wrote: post #414
Amezarak wrote: post #380

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://missionlocal.org/2024/01/y-combinator-ceo-garry-tans... > Half a dozen lawyers and judges told Mission Local that, however ill-advised, Tan’s comments do not rise to the legal definition of a death threat. Your interpretation involves a large change to how free speech has been legally defined in America for a long time. You may be interested in this case: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brandenburg_v._Ohio Wher…

"Legally allowed" doesn't mean it's protected from consequences. Call someone a dick and you're protected under free speech, but you can still get punched in the face. And a judge won't be very amenable to a possible consequent assault case if the victim was goaded.

The grandparent post is centered around the idea that it wasn't free speech, which is what I was responding to, not the idea that there can't be social consequences.

> And a judge won't be very amenable to a possible consequent assault case if the victim was goaded.

This is incorrect and fairly disturbing. The idea of "fighting words" (which are not protected speech) is extremely circumscribed; it applies basically only to the case of someone standing in front of you and saying something with the intent to provoke an "immediate instinctive reaction." (Ginsburg's words.) It absolutely does not justify punching someone you see in the street for a Tweet they made yesterday and you will go to jail for this. You will not get sympathy from a judge. Unfortunately, this is one of the very sorts of ideas that disintegrates free societies - "freedom of speech doesn't mean freedom from consequences" is true, but it doesn't justify violence legally or morally, and saying so undermines free and fair societies.

Re: 'Stupid,' 'shameful:' Tech workers on Y Combinator CEO Garry Tan's rant

#425

Post by financltravsty »

tempsy wrote: post #134
arcticbull wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The reaction feels like pearl-clutching to be honest. This is the kind of shitpost most people would be able to get away with, but Tan is now too important -- and will have to curate his communications more. Especially if he's going to take such a strong position against incumbent politicians cautious of their own images. It also feels like a smart political play by his targets to discredit him. They were probably wa…

Threatening to kill someone isn’t a “shitpost”. The fact it’s a Tupac lyric is not like common knowledge. I doubt a random poll of Twitter users would show most people would know the reference immediately.

This entire comments section is a poignant example of the spiritual dichotomy present in our society: those who have ever been immersed in 4chan-and-adjacent culture, and the bitchless and cringe.

Re: 'Stupid,' 'shameful:' Tech workers on Y Combinator CEO Garry Tan's rant

#426

Post by me_me_me »

iSnow wrote: post #292
cj wrote: post #44

As a YC alum who worked with Gary Tan directly, this is… odd. Anyone who knows Gary knows he’s a (relatively) gentle human being. I can’t imagine him hurting a fly. His tweets seem totally out of character compared to the Gary Tan I personally knew. Maybe he has changed? I’m inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt.

Alcohol disinhibits and makes people show sides they usually suppress. He probably has pent-up anger and let it all out in that tweet. I guess he's neither fully the person you know nor the person from that tweet, but both are part of the "real him"

>Alcohol disinhibits and makes people show sides they usually suppress

I always judged people based on how they act when drunk. Always stick with people who are happy drunk never angry/violent drunk

Re: 'Stupid,' 'shameful:' Tech workers on Y Combinator CEO Garry Tan's rant

#427

Post by dilawar »

cj wrote: post #44

As a YC alum who worked with Gary Tan directly, this is… odd. Anyone who knows Gary knows he’s a (relatively) gentle human being. I can’t imagine him hurting a fly. His tweets seem totally out of character compared to the Gary Tan I personally knew. Maybe he has changed? I’m inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt.

People gets intoxicated by their ideas when they find then having a large appeal. Social media accelerates it.

Re: 'Stupid,' 'shameful:' Tech workers on Y Combinator CEO Garry Tan's rant

#428

Post by everforward »

rsynnott wrote: post #320
tedk-42 wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He's paraphrased 2pac is his alcohol fuelled moment "Fuck Mobb Deep, fuck Biggie Fuck Bad Boy as a staff, record label and as a motherfuckin' crew And if you want to be down with Bad Bo, then fuck you too Chino XL, fuck you too All you motherfuckers, fuck you too (take money, take money) All of y'all motherfuckers, fuck you, die slow, motherfucker" It's immature and poor judgement but he's apologised for it so I don'…

> but he's apologised for it so I don't think it's fair to drag him down. So, the way this works is, he can say whatever he likes, but people shouldn't say mean things about him? How does this work? I'm genuinely curious; this, on the face of it, makes no sense to me at all. Is it because he's rich? I don't get it.

> I'm genuinely curious; this, on the face of it, makes no sense to me at all. Is it because he's rich? I don't get it.

For me, it's because I can remember many times when I've done something wrong or stupid and others have forgiven me. Nothing as public as this, but that's frankly more due to lack of an audience than a difference in character.

I can see a part of myself reflected back, the same part that's been a little too honest during a long happy hour, and I can empathize with how he probably feels.

I don't see myself as different at the human level, and I'd rather live in a world where we both deserve forgiveness than neither of us.

He seems genuinely remorseful. He knows he fucked up. He knows he fucked up bad. I don't see the point in beating a dead horse.

He'll probably lose his job. That's fair enough to me, you reap what you sow. Can't have that public or a role with outbursts like that. I don't see a reason to hang this around his neck for forever, though.

Re: 'Stupid,' 'shameful:' Tech workers on Y Combinator CEO Garry Tan's rant

#429

Post by 3327 »

tempestn wrote: post #257

I'm a little bit aghast at all the comments saying this is normal or no big deal. Maybe it is normal (or at least common), but it shouldn't be. If you believe it's no big deal, I can't agree. I can see this kind of behaviour from adolescents, but adults should understand that words are meaningful and have consequences, and that even if you disagree with someone, they're still a human being who deserves some modicum o…

[dead]

Re: 'Stupid,' 'shameful:' Tech workers on Y Combinator CEO Garry Tan's rant

#430

Post by dandanua »

nonrandomstring wrote: post #324
tempestn wrote: post #257

I'm a little bit aghast at all the comments saying this is normal or no big deal. Maybe it is normal (or at least common), but it shouldn't be. If you believe it's no big deal, I can't agree. I can see this kind of behaviour from adolescents, but adults should understand that words are meaningful and have consequences, and that even if you disagree with someone, they're still a human being who deserves some modicum o…

Reading this article by Rebecca Solnit [0] posted on HN here [1] absolutely helped me make sense of the Garry Tan story, and what is going on in Californian politics. It's well worth reading, but is a long and initially tedious article bemoaning the passing of a gentler, humane culture. Then about halfway through it grew some balls and teeth, and frankly I found it shocking. I had no idea California was this degenera…

> Tech billionaires often seem more interested in surviving the apocalypse than preventing it.

- pretty much sums everything we observe today. And it's only getting worse, despite tech advancements. Great article.

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