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'Stupid,' 'shameful:' Tech workers on Y Combinator CEO Garry Tan's rant

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Re: 'Stupid,' 'shameful:' Tech workers on Y Combinator CEO Garry Tan's rant

#401

Post by lwkl »

s_dev wrote: post #291
tempestn wrote: post #257

I'm a little bit aghast at all the comments saying this is normal or no big deal. Maybe it is normal (or at least common), but it shouldn't be. If you believe it's no big deal, I can't agree. I can see this kind of behaviour from adolescents, but adults should understand that words are meaningful and have consequences, and that even if you disagree with someone, they're still a human being who deserves some modicum o…

>but adults should understand that words are meaningful and have consequences What consequences should Gary face?

The consequences are a hit to your reputation (I think they call this "being canceled" nowadays). I guess you can get to a point of wealth where this doesn't really matter. But at least for 99% of people this is really harmful and takes a lot of effort to rectify.

Re: 'Stupid,' 'shameful:' Tech workers on Y Combinator CEO Garry Tan's rant

#402

Post by booleandilemma »

cj wrote: post #44

As a YC alum who worked with Gary Tan directly, this is… odd. Anyone who knows Gary knows he’s a (relatively) gentle human being. I can’t imagine him hurting a fly. His tweets seem totally out of character compared to the Gary Tan I personally knew. Maybe he has changed? I’m inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt.

I guess we saw the inner Gary Tan.

Re: 'Stupid,' 'shameful:' Tech workers on Y Combinator CEO Garry Tan's rant

#403

Post by TheCoelacanth »

andy99 wrote: post #275
TeMPOraL wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To me, it's extremely disturbing that someone would consider this whole thing as extremely disturbing in the first place. Whether people in the US are extremely oversenstive to tweets and words, or that the tweets and words have the power to suddenly make regular people hateful and violent - neither of those states are normal . Either that, or the country really is a few Twitter sparks away from civil war, which agai…

I wish I could find the clip, I think it's another Tupac song, where it plays a news clip of a stressed sounding woman saying "he says he wants to see his rivals deceased" (roughly) in response to what I assume is a line in "Can't C me". Anyway, it's funny because that clip was making fun, but sounds a lot like all the "calling for someone to die is never ok" feigned pearl clutching I've seen here. The tweet was dumb…

Perhaps the CEO of a major VC firm and a rapper should be held to different standards in their communications.

Re: 'Stupid,' 'shameful:' Tech workers on Y Combinator CEO Garry Tan's rant

#404

Post by rayiner »

paulryanrogers wrote: post #386
Amezarak wrote: post #380

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://missionlocal.org/2024/01/y-combinator-ceo-garry-tans... > Half a dozen lawyers and judges told Mission Local that, however ill-advised, Tan’s comments do not rise to the legal definition of a death threat. Your interpretation involves a large change to how free speech has been legally defined in America for a long time. You may be interested in this case: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brandenburg_v._Ohio Wher…

Even a supreme court can be wrong sometimes. In the US that's been happening more often of late.

Can you give an example?

Re: 'Stupid,' 'shameful:' Tech workers on Y Combinator CEO Garry Tan's rant

#405

Post by xyst »

cj wrote: post #44

As a YC alum who worked with Gary Tan directly, this is… odd. Anyone who knows Gary knows he’s a (relatively) gentle human being. I can’t imagine him hurting a fly. His tweets seem totally out of character compared to the Gary Tan I personally knew. Maybe he has changed? I’m inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt.

It was supposedly a drunken rant. Usually when you are intoxicated that really shows who you are. Maybe he kept up the facade really well.

OR

like you said, maybe he is on some behavioral or cognitive decline. Another Lee Holloway situation [1]

[1] https://www.wired.com/story/lee-holloway-devastating-decline...

Re: 'Stupid,' 'shameful:' Tech workers on Y Combinator CEO Garry Tan's rant

#406

Post by Kye »

Amezarak wrote: post #383
otikik wrote: post #366

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not a lawyer, but if some deranged individual who follows him takes his comment and face value and murders someone, he will face many consequences. Firstly, he would be involved on murder. That's not a great experience to have, for most people. He would at least be on trial. I don't exactly know how incitement to murder is treated in the US. It could even be considered domestic terrorism (an assassination made t…

Lawyers and judges have already been consulted and concluded that no crime was committed. https://missionlocal.org/2024/01/y-combinator-ceo-garry-tans... This would not change ex post facto because of someone else's actions. In the US, what he did said is disgusting but legally protected free speech. It's conceivable that he could be opened up to a civil lawsuit, but that's about it.

A good video from an actual lawyer on where the legal lines are when it comes to incitement: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XwqAInN9HWI

Re: 'Stupid,' 'shameful:' Tech workers on Y Combinator CEO Garry Tan's rant

#407

Post by slibhb »

hef19898 wrote: post #323
s_dev wrote: post #291

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>but adults should understand that words are meaningful and have consequences What consequences should Gary face?

Two fold: Legal consequences if some of the people threatened by him want to sue or have him indicted about it. And whatever YC as his employer sees fit for the resulted harm on the reputation of the company. So, in the end, it can be everything from nothing to a criminal charge and conviction with loosing his job somewhere in the middle.

There is zero chance he could be indicted for a threat based on that tweet. No responsible prosecutor would try.

Even if you take "die slow motherfucker" literally, it's not a threat. A wish that someone dies is not a threat. "I will kill you" is a threat.

Re: 'Stupid,' 'shameful:' Tech workers on Y Combinator CEO Garry Tan's rant

#408

Post by slibhb »

otikik wrote: post #366
s_dev wrote: post #291

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>but adults should understand that words are meaningful and have consequences What consequences should Gary face?

I am not a lawyer, but if some deranged individual who follows him takes his comment and face value and murders someone, he will face many consequences. Firstly, he would be involved on murder. That's not a great experience to have, for most people. He would at least be on trial. I don't exactly know how incitement to murder is treated in the US. It could even be considered domestic terrorism (an assassination made t…

> He would at least be on trial. I don't exactly know how incitement to murder is treated in the US.

That's very clear!

In no way is "die slow motherfucker" incitement to murder, whether or not the person is question is actually murdered.

Re: 'Stupid,' 'shameful:' Tech workers on Y Combinator CEO Garry Tan's rant

#409

Post by rayiner »

Arainach wrote: post #203
TeMPOraL wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To me, it's extremely disturbing that someone would consider this whole thing as extremely disturbing in the first place. Whether people in the US are extremely oversenstive to tweets and words, or that the tweets and words have the power to suddenly make regular people hateful and violent - neither of those states are normal . Either that, or the country really is a few Twitter sparks away from civil war, which agai…

Posting that you want a group of city councilors to die is not normal behavior. It's not normal when sober, it's not normal on alcohol, it's not normal for any functioning member of society. Anyone saying these things is disturbing. The fact that someone who a number of people believe is intelligent and worth listening to would say such things is extremely disturbing.

What are you talking about? Political effigies are a whole thing, and not just in America: https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2016-election/giant-trump-e...

Re: 'Stupid,' 'shameful:' Tech workers on Y Combinator CEO Garry Tan's rant

#410

Post by Cthulhu_ »

mcv wrote: post #273
tempestn wrote: post #257

I'm a little bit aghast at all the comments saying this is normal or no big deal. Maybe it is normal (or at least common), but it shouldn't be. If you believe it's no big deal, I can't agree. I can see this kind of behaviour from adolescents, but adults should understand that words are meaningful and have consequences, and that even if you disagree with someone, they're still a human being who deserves some modicum o…

Yeah, apparently it was a pop reference, and that makes it okay? The problem with references is that not everybody gets the reference, and without that (and possibly even with) this is a death threat. And with today's highly polarized and volatile political situation, you need to be really careful with that. I've come to expect this sort of behaviour from random internet trolls, but a CEO really should know better. I…

Yeah there's too much insensitivity being brushed off as "it's a reference", "it's a joke", "it's a meme", or with things like "you can't say anything anymore without anyone getting offended". That's not accepting responsibility for what you said. As is "I / he was drunk"; again, shifting blame. It's an explanation, not an excuse, and if you "become" an unpleasant person when drunk, you're an unpleasant person full stop. Stop drinking then.
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