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On a Tesla: Don't

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Re: On a Tesla: Don't

#61

Post by plastic3169 »

Turskarama wrote: post #55
plastic3169 wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

”In 2003, the Transportation Research Board Committee, chaired by two psychologists, reported that "Enhanced SBRs" (ESBRs) could save an additional 1,000 lives a year.[100] Research by the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety found that Ford's ESBR, which provides an intermittent chime for up to five minutes if the driver is unbelted, sounding for 6 seconds then pausing for 30, increased seat belt use by 5 percenta…

That's the driver, but I've had similar problems with the car yelling at me when I put a sufficiently heavy bag of shopping on the passenger seat. The only seat where the weight is guaranteed to be a human is the drivers seat. By all means, put an alarm on that seat, but the other seats can contain things other than passengers.

Yes to clarify the false positives are also the thing that annoy me. Not when the system works as intended. But as somebody else said here if you have a passenger it really makes a difference to the social situation. I don’t know that much about safety engineering, but my hunch is that if there was a bypass button it would weaken the system significantly. Maybe it could be temporary and deep in the menu.

Re: On a Tesla: Don't

#62

Post by simiones »

resolutebat wrote: post #46
epups wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are already losing the lead on the EV market to BYD: https://www.wsj.com/business/autos/tesla-delivered-1-81-mill... I personally think this prediction is grounded. It has been over-promising and under-delivering for a while, and Musk has gone from a money printing machine to someone perceived as toxic/erratic. They will face difficulties in a scenario where competitors can make better, cheaper cars, and their s…

I'm really having trouble understanding how a company with the best selling car on the entire planet (more Model Ys sold than Toyota Corollas or RAV4s in 2023) can be accused of "under-delivering".

Under-delivering is always compared to your promises. And they significantly over-promise, and, thus, consistently under-deliver. Especially at the company level - look at the Cybertruck and electric trucks - way over schedule, under powered, and under-delivering on every single metric they claimed originally. FSD is the other major example - which has been "fully autonomous safer than a human driver by the end of this year" for 5+ years already, and is none of those things in practice.

Also, while the sales are nothing to scoff at for such an expensive car, Tesla is still a small player in the world car market. Toyota sells more cars in the USA alone than Tesla sells worldwide (but much cheaper).

Re: On a Tesla: Don't

#63

Post by foul »

>This was a question I used to get all the time. In 2016, we got rid of both of our cars and left the country on a sabbatical. When we returned, we bought a Tesla Model 3.

It's a wild introduction, something I would expect from someone like Lessig.

Re: On a Tesla: Don't

#64

Post by bravetraveler »

stephenr wrote: post #39
bzzzt wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably because you don't get a spare tire so you have to wait until road side assistance comes to you.

... what does roadside assistance do in that scenario? They can't be carrying spare tires of every variety, and the equipment to fit them .. this just sounds like a terrible non-solution to a solved problem.

I don't think they care, my Mustang came with a fix-it kit and that's it

No donut or anything. Goop and an air pump made by Honda

Re: On a Tesla: Don't

#65

Post by bravetraveler »

andyferris wrote: post #31
quonn wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> - it is dangerously hard to use any control that doesn't have a dedicated button. The touchscreen in a moving car is a moving mess of tiny targets crowded too close together No it isn't. > - even if you have a dedicated control for say wipers, you will still curse interval wipers. Sensor-based wipers fail to predict rain regularly. I discussed this topic recently with a friend, her Mercedes has the same problem and…

I’ve literally never seen a car without a spare tire. It’s usually hidden underneath the trunk these days. I assumed it was law? EDIT: never mind, I see Teslas come with a repair kit instead. (I suppose by modern car you might mean electric.) TIL

Common for different reasons, remarkably annoying

Buy a Mustang with bigger brakes or wheels, you get the same treatment

Re: On a Tesla: Don't

#66

Post by akmarinov »

bzzzt wrote: post #29
Mashimo wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> - don't get a flat tire if you care about your time. If you can't change a spare, nvm. Is it harder to change a spare on a tesla compare to other cars?

Probably because you don't get a spare tire so you have to wait until road side assistance comes to you.

That's the case for most cars post 2017

Re: On a Tesla: Don't

#67

Post by quonn »

Dalewyn wrote: post #56
quonn wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you give an example of something that really needs to be adjusted on the touchscreen while driving that cannot be adjusted using the buttons on the steering wheel on the Model 3? I never ever need to do this. Additionally the lane keeping and adaptive cruise control on the highway are rock solid, so even if you would look briefly - for example at the navigation system, just like in any other car - not much can ha…

>using the buttons on the steering wheel on the Model 3? I suppose I should clarify I am speaking generally, I don't own nor have I ever driven a Tesla. I have, however, had to deal with touchscreen controls in recent years. >even if you would look briefly >a brief peak at a touchscreen. The thing about touchscreens is they demand more than just a "brief" "peak". I need to look at it, obviously, and also devote consi…

The fact is that you don't have to look at all, because the Tesla touchscreen does not have modalities. (There is a drill-down menu that you NEVER need to open during driving). Everything else is accessible in exactly the same spot at the bottom of the screen and no looking is required.

Additionally, as I said, the steering wheel buttons handle everything that matters, so there is no need to even interact with the touchscreen at all during driving.

Let's look at the interactions in detail:

- Most controls of the car are done using physical controls. This includes left and right blinking, reversing, steering, lights, wipers, honking, the acceleration and break pedals, windows, seats, doors, opening compartments, audio and media controls, autopilot and lane keeping, camera controls.

- The only things where interaction with the touchscreen is preferable are (a) setting a destination in the navigation system - for going home or to work this is literally a swipe gesture on the main screen, usually done before the car is started and (b) adjusting the heating or temperature. For this there are two buttons at the bottom of the screen, always in the same location. However I always have them on auto and there is simply no need to fiddle with this, ever. If it's important to you it can be configured to be on the steering wheel as well.

- I think people who think that constant adjustment of the temperature settings is necessary are used to driving cars where this is not sufficiently automated. I have seat and wheel heating set to auto and that works just fine. I have set my temperature to 20 °C and it feels comfortable in summer and winter. Why would I want to change this while driving?

- Setting a new destination in the navigation system can be done using voice. This is not great but will certainly be improved. A modern system like Whisper should handle this easily. In any case, why would anyone want to do this while driving? And in any case it will be the same issue in any other car, because this simply requires typing out letters which is difficult.

> I would argue worse than "text and drive" smartphones.

Obviously holding a phone and typing out text on a tiny keyboard that certainly has to be looked at takes far more focus than touching a pre-defined spot on a huge fixed screen. But as I said this is never needed.

Re: On a Tesla: Don't

#68

Post by akmarinov »

alister wrote: post #59

A Tesla used to be called the "best car ever made" — eleven years ago. In 2013 Consumer Reports called the Tesla Model S the best car it had ever tested. The Model S earned a score of 99 out of a possible 100 in the magazine's tests. "If it could recharge in any gas station in three minutes, this car would score about 110," said Jake Fisher, head of auto testing for Consumer Reports . Fisher called the car's performa…

Tesla focused on FSD almost exclusively and everything in the car's software suffered because of that and stupid decisions to remove hardware.

Autopilot is on a separate branch from FSD, not getting significant updates with the promise that at some point, it'll be merged with the FSD branch and it'll be super awesome - this year for sure, but maybe next year or 10 years after, look we made a robot that's definitely not a guy in a suit and it'll be out in 5 years, maybe 10, it can water plants now!, look a Cybertruck! isn't steel cool, etc

When they switched from Mobileye to their own stack, it noticeably regressed in performance, then they worked to get it to work decently, but dropped the radar during Covid, going all in on Vision, regressing it even further. They promised at that time to at some point match the original Autopilot by reintroducing a distance of 1 and a max speed higher than 140 km/h and it's been 2 years since then with nothing on the front.

Summon/ Smart summon as the guy in the article points out - is great, but doesn't work without USS sensors, which they removed and the functionality is coming back some day, but likely not soon, because it's not a priority. They've been selling cars for more than a year now that don't have that functionality, even though it's in a package worth 4000 euros that gets you basically nothing.

Autopark - same thing, just look at these videos as a comparison - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nsb2XBAIWyA&pp=ygUTcnN5bW1vb... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfM8pZS7PFU&t=190s&pp=ygUTcn...

It's easily the worst out of all manufacturers.

In the meantime FSD V11 will be the big one, V12 will finally drop the beta tag, etc, etc things that never happen and the rest of the functionalities just rot away.

Re: On a Tesla: Don't

#69

Post by resolutebat »

rsynnott wrote: post #47

> That’s what the brain does: we learn not to see the ugly that we can’t change. Huh. This must be what it's like to be a glass-half-full person. Speaking for myself, I tend to focus in on it rather obsessively. > Elizabeth Holmes, at least, didn’t kill anyone. Statistically, she almost certainly did. > I’ve never actually thought that I needed a fart machine in my car, but pre-teens think it essential. IMO this enco…

The fart noise is played through the regular audio speakers inside the car, not outside it.

Re: On a Tesla: Don't

#70

Post by epgui »

robertlagrant wrote: post #13
Joker_vD wrote: post #4

> But here’s where the CEO becomes relevant. Tesla is, in many ways, Elon Musk. Some parts are astonishing, inspiring, and good — what I’ve called above the car on down. Other parts are little more than lies and gimmicks. From what I understand (and I may be completely wrong), those "astonishing and good" parts, about the design of the vehicle itself, were already mostly in place before Musk managed to place himself…

> From what I understand (and I may be completely wrong), those "astonishing and good" parts, about the design of the vehicle itself, were already mostly in place before Musk managed to place himself as Tesla's CEO (which is an interesting story in itself). I find it very hard to know what's true about such a polarising figure. Personally I don't think it's likely that Musk has done what he's done without talent and…

I think a big part of the problem is that people tend to see things in black and white (or rather, fail to account for nuance).

Elon is a massively intelligent and business savvy guy with strong engineering talent.

He is also unhinged and an absolute idiot.

Both things are true at the same time and in different ways. People tend to let one of the two perspectives overwhelm their impression of him as a whole.

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