Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

ICJ orders Israel to prevent genocide in Gaza, stops short of ordering ceasefire

apnews.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

711–720 of 1001 posts

Re: ICJ orders Israel to prevent genocide in Gaza, stops short of ordering ceasefire

#711

Post by matsemann »

surume wrote: post #263

Hi All, I am a combat soldier and commander in the IDF currently fighting in Gaza. We are not committing any genocide. The give away for Genocide is that there are mass graves, which in Gaza there are not. Yes there is collateral damage because Hamas uses civilians as human shields, so we have no choice but to kill them too, but we do not specifically target them. We risk ourselves and our soldiers to ensure that the…

> so before you give your full throated support to Hamas, let me ask you

This is a straw man. Condemning IDFs slaughtering of children isn't the same as supporting Hamas. I condemn both.

Re: ICJ orders Israel to prevent genocide in Gaza, stops short of ordering ceasefire

#712

Post by adhamsalama »

mrkeen wrote: post #558
worik wrote: post #331

Earlier quoted context omitted.

True Nation states are often immoral and hypocritical The outrage from the USA at the invasion of Ukraine, when the invasion of Iraq is a crime of the same magnitude - both dreadful stains on humanity Most recently the international support for the actions of the IDF whilst condemning Russian actions in Ukraine SA is just normal in this regard

> The outrage from the USA at the invasion of Ukraine, when the invasion of Iraq is a crime of the same magnitude. I was certainly against it in 2003. The WMDs were bullshit. A war on "terror" is farcical. The profiteering and the industrial military complex, etc. But I did later come around to the idea of getting Saddam and his government to stop genociding the Kurds. Of course you should always assume a country lik…

Yeah, they invaded Iraq, destabilized the country, and killed hundreds of thousands of civilians. No biggie.

Re: ICJ orders Israel to prevent genocide in Gaza, stops short of ordering ceasefire

#715

Post by nerpderp82 »

Sporktacular wrote: post #699
surume wrote: post #333

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you for the kind words. Will reach out when I get home next. Been a long day - we did a big mission today and I'm wiped so please excuse the short answers. 1. Hamas was located in a significant want under Al-shifa. Israel released video of our commando unit raiding it. You can find that video online. Hard to watch. 2. Because they're angry and they're being stupid and reacting emotionally. Please understand, th…

> "I mean, you could reverse the question and ask "why are the Palestinians occupying Israeli land". How? The West Bank, Golan. This is not the State of Israel's land. Never was. But it's being taken regardless. Israel's security justification might be taken seriously if it wasn't simultaneously supporting settlers who steal land. Stop them and you will find more international support. > The Palestinians arent a peop…

Just put this right on the shelf, "The Palestinians arent a people, per se."

I can't even. Genocide isn't just killing a people, it is also de-peopling them. So many in the entire comment section don't even know they are saying the quiet part.

Re: ICJ orders Israel to prevent genocide in Gaza, stops short of ordering ceasefire

#716

Post by mkoubaa »

EvgeniyZh wrote: post #346
masom wrote: post #292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Yes there is collateral damage because Hamas uses civilians as human shields, so we have no choice but to kill them too, but we do not specifically target them. > we have no choice but to kill them too, but we do not specifically target them > we have no choice but to kill them too bruh... Those are war crimes according to the UN https://www.un.org/en/genocideprevention/war-crimes.shtml

> which would be clearly excessive in relation to the concrete and direct overall military advantage anticipated; You can't just put a single civilian in every military base and be protected by international law. Collateral damage isn't necessarily a war crime.

I agree, collateral damage is not a war crime... Until it is paired with a not-hidden intent to punish the population

Re: ICJ orders Israel to prevent genocide in Gaza, stops short of ordering ceasefire

#717

Post by leereeves »

surume wrote: post #333
tomp wrote: post #293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hi there, I personally admire the work you do, I fully support Israel in it's war against evil, I hope you eradicate Hamas (ideally they would all surrender, but that's unlikely, so the other option is they get killed) as soon as you can. If you doubt any of these words, check out my tweets/likes (@tomprimozic) However, there's 3 "contentious" points that I want to ask (my go-to Jewish (& very pro-Israel) close frien…

Thank you for the kind words. Will reach out when I get home next. Been a long day - we did a big mission today and I'm wiped so please excuse the short answers. 1. Hamas was located in a significant want under Al-shifa. Israel released video of our commando unit raiding it. You can find that video online. Hard to watch. 2. Because they're angry and they're being stupid and reacting emotionally. Please understand, th…

> why are the Palestinians occupying Israeli land?

How can you write that when you immediately answer your own question?

> [they] were living in the area at the time of the creation of the state of israel.

It really makes Israel sound colonialist. As does saying "We're in a war to claim territory with the Palestinians."

Re: ICJ orders Israel to prevent genocide in Gaza, stops short of ordering ceasefire

#718

Post by mrangle »

The primary problem was always that there are too many parties who have an interest in the existence of Hamas.

Put differently, there are too many parties with an interest in using the Palestinians as pawns. Leaving aside the views of any specific Palestinian. As no serious person can dispute the ease of radicalizing destitute people without educations and with PTSD.

As long as this is the case, the Palestinians, on the whole, will present as radicalized.

The continued goal can't be to use them as pawns. The goal has to be to peacefully save every last remaning Palestinian life, at all costs. In spite of the interests of any of the people who use them.

Accomplishing that goal, at all peaceful costs, will be distasteful to both the people who want to sacrifice the Palestinians for Islamic land interests as well as to the people who see them as, at minimum, legitimate collateral damage.

But that is what will be required to take Palestinian civilians out of the middle of this endless nightmare.

Re: ICJ orders Israel to prevent genocide in Gaza, stops short of ordering ceasefire

#719

Post by rashkov »

bakuninsbart wrote: post #584
smoothjazz wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly I'm not trying to mis-read the verdict which is why I asked the question. I think all of Israel's strategies to date include the death of Palestinians. Since that's explicitly forbidden with that ruling, how will they continue to fight? Will they just ignore the ruling or change tactics?

You are allowed under international law to lead war with significant amounts of civilian casualties. The issue being judged is claims of Israel committing a genocide. This is just a preliminary order while the full case is considered, and it might be bad PR to disregard it, but nothing else will come of it. When hearing 'genocide', most people immediately jump to the Holocaust, but the definition used by the ICC and…

You might find this to be an interesting read, even if it may not change your mind. “What Did Top Israeli War Officials Really Say About Gaza? Journalists and jurists point to damning quotes from Israel’s war cabinet as evidence of genocidal intent. But the citations are not what they seem.”

https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2024/01/is...

Archive version: https://archive.ph/GV14c

Re: ICJ orders Israel to prevent genocide in Gaza, stops short of ordering ceasefire

#720

Post by riscy »

surume wrote: post #263

Hi All, I am a combat soldier and commander in the IDF currently fighting in Gaza. We are not committing any genocide. The give away for Genocide is that there are mass graves, which in Gaza there are not. Yes there is collateral damage because Hamas uses civilians as human shields, so we have no choice but to kill them too, but we do not specifically target them. We risk ourselves and our soldiers to ensure that the…

> The give away for Genocide is that there are mass graves, which in Gaza there are not.

The rubble of the numerous civilian homes and buildings you've leveled are the mass graves.

Post reply on HN