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Linus Torvalds on new Chromebook Aura UI

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Re: Linus Torvalds on new Chromebook Aura UI

#81

Post by fragsworth »

ghshephard wrote: post #77
wavephorm wrote: post #8

The "All-Web" paradigm is coming, folks. And it really doesn't matter how much you love your iPhone, or your Android, or Windows phone. Native apps are toast, in the long run. Your data is moving to the cloud -- your pictures, your music, your movies, and every document you write. It's all going up there, and local hard drives will be history within 3 years. And what that means is ALL software is heading there too. N…

Great concept - your timeline is way off. Wireless network connectivity is unlikely to be where it needs to be for at least another 20 years for people who work with larger documents. Hell, I have a tough enough time in our corporate offices in São Paulo, Brazil accessing 100 MB Slide Decks in our Redwood City offices over _wired_ connections - I don't want to think how long before places like Belém get half decent _…

"Cloud devices" can still use local hardware acceleration, storage, and memory for client-side things. Nothing is really preventing us from developing cloud-based video and photo editing software.

Some work might have to be done to minimize the amount of data that gets transferred when saving and loading, but that's about it. I'm sure if you compress your 100MB Slide Decks file you'll find it much easier to send over!

Re: Linus Torvalds on new Chromebook Aura UI

#82

Post by goodgracious »

Arelius wrote: post #70
goodgracious wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Solution: VPS outside Canada to do your downloads from. But what you describe is a networking problem (transit costs of your ISP passed on to you). Not a storage problem. A "cloud storage" provider is just going to keep the data you store in a datacenter near to you anyway, not halfway around the world. But it's not like keeping your physical stuff with a storage company. You can easily store the data yourself with m…

That's not a solution, you still need to get the downloads to a local system to use them for that vast majority of media.

True, but he's admitting he doesn't access ("use") the data in the same month he downloads it. So downloading from his VPS IP address to the VPS's secondary storage, outside Canada, won't count toward his monthly Canada ISP's cap. It's only when he decides to download data from the VPS's secondary storage to his "local system" he'll begin using his monthly allowance.

Re: Linus Torvalds on new Chromebook Aura UI

#83

Post by ceol »

jahmed wrote: post #66
kristopolous wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if you were 100% correct, hard drives aren't going anywhere. Browser cache is around 1GB and web developers are itching for vast landscapes of local storage systems. And where do you expect the operating system and marvelous web stack where all these things are created to reside? Burned in EEPROM? I think the consumer already can't really differentiate between what is local or over the internet, they don't know…

>But if what you say is right, the pendulum, at the consumer level, will soon swing back the other way the first time that someone can't access the "cloud" on a trip or forgets to pay their "cloud access bill" (phone/internet whatever) and then gets locked out of ... well, everything. One day the idea that you don't have internet access will be just as silly as saying you don't have electricity. Its in the very infan…

> One day the idea that you don't have internet access will be just as silly as saying you don't have electricity.

I don't think that day will be in the next 3 years.

Re: Linus Torvalds on new Chromebook Aura UI

#84

Post by mark_integerdsv »

wavephorm wrote: post #38
cageface wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This most certainly is not what I, or a lot of people want in a computing device Most people don't even understand what a filesystem is, nevermind whether it's open or not. I agree with you that data is moving online but that's orthogonal to the native vs web app question.

I want a "cloud filesystem", but want it controlled by ME, not Apple, and not iCloud. That's the problem. Apple wants to control the filesystem, and I, and others are not willing to accept this horrific scenario.

You "and others" are in the tiniest minority. Surely the current state of the market is clear enough indication of this?

I don't know you from a bar of soap but reading your comments, I get the impression of an American late-teen with a solid amount of technical knowledge, strong opinions but staggeringly little perspective.

Even amongst those who are capable of administering an 'open platform cloud infrastructure' there are few who have the time. In my own circumstances, ten years of programming experience, recently shifted from consultancy to an analysis role at a major financial institution, start up on the side, seven week old baby,ten year old daughter, wife, 33 years of age... Let me tell you: the more my technology 'just works' the better. I won't accept my rights bing trampled on but a system that is elegant and robust albeit a bit restrictive is far preferable to spending hour on end tinkering with something that I need to actually use as opposed to configure endlessly.

Re: Linus Torvalds on new Chromebook Aura UI

#85

Post by ridiculous_fish »

randomfool wrote: post #58
furyofantares wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Care to explain why you believe native apps are toast in the long run, or how that's related to data moving to the cloud? Web apps solved the problem of having to figure out how to find, install, or update software and not having it everywhere you go. App stores have caught up on discovery/installation/updates, and mobile has solved the problem of not having it everywhere I go. Web apps will eventually catch up on pe…

I believe that Scott Jenson put it best in 'Why Mobile Apps Must Die'- http://vimeo.com/33692624 Watch it. The problem with native apps is the installation barrier- if I had apps installed to do everything that I'd love my phone to do, I'd be overwhelmed with hundreds of apps installed. Web-based apps have the potential to slip in and out of use as necessary, with more applicable discovery mechanisms (geo, proximity,…

You speak of the "installation barrier" as if it's something insurmountable. But why should it be? A native app zero-install mechanism seems more plausible to me than wide adoption of a hypothetical geolocating proximity web.

The reason is that native apps can move so much more quickly than web apps. I'll bet Apple could get widespread adoption of a zero-install feature on iOS in six months, simply by mandating it for the app store and featuring early adopters. But HTML5 YouTube has been in beta for over two years, and the tag was introduced over half a decade ago. The web moves at a snail's pace by comparison.

I did try to watch the video, but scrubbing didn't work, which sort of illustrates my point.

Re: Linus Torvalds on new Chromebook Aura UI

#86

Post by cageface »

randomfool wrote: post #58
furyofantares wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Care to explain why you believe native apps are toast in the long run, or how that's related to data moving to the cloud? Web apps solved the problem of having to figure out how to find, install, or update software and not having it everywhere you go. App stores have caught up on discovery/installation/updates, and mobile has solved the problem of not having it everywhere I go. Web apps will eventually catch up on pe…

I believe that Scott Jenson put it best in 'Why Mobile Apps Must Die'- http://vimeo.com/33692624 Watch it. The problem with native apps is the installation barrier- if I had apps installed to do everything that I'd love my phone to do, I'd be overwhelmed with hundreds of apps installed. Web-based apps have the potential to slip in and out of use as necessary, with more applicable discovery mechanisms (geo, proximity,…

Both web apps and native apps are here to stay. They have complementary strengths and weaknesses.

Re: Linus Torvalds on new Chromebook Aura UI

#87

Post by pjmlp »

wavephorm wrote: post #8

The "All-Web" paradigm is coming, folks. And it really doesn't matter how much you love your iPhone, or your Android, or Windows phone. Native apps are toast, in the long run. Your data is moving to the cloud -- your pictures, your music, your movies, and every document you write. It's all going up there, and local hard drives will be history within 3 years. And what that means is ALL software is heading there too. N…

I surely hope not.

The web is for documents.

Re: Linus Torvalds on new Chromebook Aura UI

#88

Post by vectorpush »

wavephorm wrote: post #8

The "All-Web" paradigm is coming, folks. And it really doesn't matter how much you love your iPhone, or your Android, or Windows phone. Native apps are toast, in the long run. Your data is moving to the cloud -- your pictures, your music, your movies, and every document you write. It's all going up there, and local hard drives will be history within 3 years. And what that means is ALL software is heading there too. N…

I hate to break it to you, but a web browser is just an arbitrary native app running data over TCP/IP. Native apps aren't going anywhere.

Re: Linus Torvalds on new Chromebook Aura UI

#89

Post by grego »

wavephorm wrote: post #8

The "All-Web" paradigm is coming, folks. And it really doesn't matter how much you love your iPhone, or your Android, or Windows phone. Native apps are toast, in the long run. Your data is moving to the cloud -- your pictures, your music, your movies, and every document you write. It's all going up there, and local hard drives will be history within 3 years. And what that means is ALL software is heading there too. N…

Bollocks I say. It's all about latency and bandwidth. If I'd have fiber in my cabin in Montana, I might agree. Perfect connectivity all times is just a dream. Plus native will always have an edge. Sure my calendar is in the cloud, but everything.. nah, don't think so. For photos and videos the pipes ain't fat enough for anything but backup and sync.

Re: Linus Torvalds on new Chromebook Aura UI

#90

Post by roel_v »

ekianjo wrote: post #44
wavephorm wrote: post #8

The "All-Web" paradigm is coming, folks. And it really doesn't matter how much you love your iPhone, or your Android, or Windows phone. Native apps are toast, in the long run. Your data is moving to the cloud -- your pictures, your music, your movies, and every document you write. It's all going up there, and local hard drives will be history within 3 years. And what that means is ALL software is heading there too. N…

Yeah, and in 2 years desktop computers will be gone, people will only use tablets, and Linux will have completely disappeared as a desktop environment (together with the fore-mentioned gone desktop computers, probably?). I always like people who over-simplify things to the extreme. They don't seem to understand that different solutions exist because there are different needs. Ever thought about doing video editing of…

"and Linux will have completely disappeared as a desktop environment"

Of course not! 2014 will be the year of Linux on the desktop, just like every other year for the last 15 years!

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