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Linus Torvalds on new Chromebook Aura UI

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Re: Linus Torvalds on new Chromebook Aura UI

#41

Post by wavephorm »

goodgracious wrote: post #31
wavephorm wrote: post #8

The "All-Web" paradigm is coming, folks. And it really doesn't matter how much you love your iPhone, or your Android, or Windows phone. Native apps are toast, in the long run. Your data is moving to the cloud -- your pictures, your music, your movies, and every document you write. It's all going up there, and local hard drives will be history within 3 years. And what that means is ALL software is heading there too. N…

Nonsense. True, companies will encourage voluntarily uploading your stuff to their computers. Why shouldn't they? Just like they solicit your email address, track your movements, snarf your smartphone address book and other neat tricks. There's value in getting that info. That doesn't mean everyone is going to fall for it. Some will, no doubt. But GB's are getting cheaper every day. And not just for "cloud providers"…

  Are we to imagine a future where consumers cannot purchase storage media?
Yes that's coming. Many countries are starting to put tariffs on hard drives. And in my country, Canada, they also slow down your internet when downloading large files and it costs $1.5 per gigabyte to exceed my 85GB/mo limit. I might as well redirect my downloads to an online service and keep all my data online until I need.

My bet is within 3 years we'll reach the threshold where it might as well be worth it to store files online rather download them and store them permanently on hard drives on a computer running constantly in your home.

Re: Linus Torvalds on new Chromebook Aura UI

#42

Post by shock-value »

wavephorm wrote: post #38
cageface wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This most certainly is not what I, or a lot of people want in a computing device Most people don't even understand what a filesystem is, nevermind whether it's open or not. I agree with you that data is moving online but that's orthogonal to the native vs web app question.

I want a "cloud filesystem", but want it controlled by ME, not Apple, and not iCloud. That's the problem. Apple wants to control the filesystem, and I, and others are not willing to accept this horrific scenario.

Go read cageface's comment again. I think you are using the words "native app" wrong, or at least different than what most people think it means.

You are correct that data is moving into the cloud, and away from Apple's restricted file system (or any local file system). But that has nothing to do with native vs. web (HTML) apps. Native apps can easily store all their data in the cloud (ANY cloud, not just iCloud), and still be native apps in the usual sense of the word.

It seems to me that the trend is toward native, cloud based apps. And these two concepts are not in conflict. As cageface says, they are orthogonal.

Re: Linus Torvalds on new Chromebook Aura UI

#43

Post by ableal »

moistgorilla wrote: post #20
wavephorm wrote: post #8

The "All-Web" paradigm is coming, folks. And it really doesn't matter how much you love your iPhone, or your Android, or Windows phone. Native apps are toast, in the long run. Your data is moving to the cloud -- your pictures, your music, your movies, and every document you write. It's all going up there, and local hard drives will be history within 3 years. And what that means is ALL software is heading there too. N…

Great, another prophet. Worst thing is, if you somehow are correct, you would not stop shoving it in people's faces how right you are. Cloud is not the future, not with the current US internet infrastructure at least. Also why would someone pay 10 dollars a month for 50 GB of space in the cloud when you can buy 1 TB portable hard drives for dirt cheap?

> Great, another prophet.

Heh. "Pandora didn't get half the kicking around she deserved", as I think that R.A.Heinlein jokingly put it.

(Not that I believe that GP is that prescient.)

Re: Linus Torvalds on new Chromebook Aura UI

#44

Post by ekianjo »

wavephorm wrote: post #8

The "All-Web" paradigm is coming, folks. And it really doesn't matter how much you love your iPhone, or your Android, or Windows phone. Native apps are toast, in the long run. Your data is moving to the cloud -- your pictures, your music, your movies, and every document you write. It's all going up there, and local hard drives will be history within 3 years. And what that means is ALL software is heading there too. N…

Yeah, and in 2 years desktop computers will be gone, people will only use tablets, and Linux will have completely disappeared as a desktop environment (together with the fore-mentioned gone desktop computers, probably?).

I always like people who over-simplify things to the extreme. They don't seem to understand that different solutions exist because there are different needs. Ever thought about doing video editing of a More-than-HD-video on a network connection ? Ever thought of RAW images storage, taking up 30 seconds to load one image through your ISP? Ever thought of people living away from large cities, with slow internet connection ?

Obviously not. You must be living in a microcosm where everyone has 1Tb/s Net access under their tables.

Re: Linus Torvalds on new Chromebook Aura UI

#45

Post by cantankerous »

unimpressive wrote: post #30
wickedchicken wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Also why would someone pay 10 dollars a month for 50 GB of space in the cloud when you can buy 1 TB portable hard drives for dirt cheap? housefires.

If anything I'd be more worried about thieves stealing my data. (In the literal, 'break into my house and take it.' sort of way.) I know it's happened to at least one indie developer. And at least one youtube blogger that comes to mind. That having been said, local hard drives aren't going to die anytime soon. Uncle McCarthy has not yet had his day, at least not on that one.

You know, encryption and a decently strong password pretty much seals the deal on somebody physically stealing your data. There is no reason to not encrypt your home computer if you are so concerned.

Re: Linus Torvalds on new Chromebook Aura UI

#46

Post by tlrobinson »

wavephorm wrote: post #8

The "All-Web" paradigm is coming, folks. And it really doesn't matter how much you love your iPhone, or your Android, or Windows phone. Native apps are toast, in the long run. Your data is moving to the cloud -- your pictures, your music, your movies, and every document you write. It's all going up there, and local hard drives will be history within 3 years. And what that means is ALL software is heading there too. N…

I mostly agree, but web apps have been set back a few years by mobile.

I had this conversation with my girlfriend the other day:

Her: If ____ had a [mobile] app I'd waste so much time on it.

Me: You know you can use their website on your phone, right?

Her: Yeah, but apps are so much better.

Out of curiosity, I went to this particular site on my phone and they actually do have a mobile web app, complete with home screen icon and the meta tags to make it fullscreen. If you add it your homescreen it could pass as a decent native app.

There are two problems with web apps right now:

1) Quality. It's pretty hard to make really nice mobile web apps, or apps in general. There are lots of behaviors in the browser that are un-app-like which you need to work around. Native platforms were designed for apps from the start. Performance can also be an issue (possibly solved by something like NativeClient).

2) Discoverability. Users look for app in the app store first. If they don't find it they often don't check for a mobile web app, either because they're not aware they exist or they assume it will be crap. App stores need to have better integration for web apps. In the meantime, wrappers like PhoneGap can help.

Re: Linus Torvalds on new Chromebook Aura UI

#47

Post by deet »

It saddens me that Chrome OS is switching from full-screen windows to a stacking metaphor. The opportunity to move to a tiling (even just two columns like Metro) paradigm was there and would be a natural extension of the tab metaphor.

Disappointing, although I'm happy to see progress towards an OS that treats web apps as first-class.

Re: Linus Torvalds on new Chromebook Aura UI

#48

Post by unimpressive »

cantankerous wrote: post #45
unimpressive wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If anything I'd be more worried about thieves stealing my data. (In the literal, 'break into my house and take it.' sort of way.) I know it's happened to at least one indie developer. And at least one youtube blogger that comes to mind. That having been said, local hard drives aren't going to die anytime soon. Uncle McCarthy has not yet had his day, at least not on that one.

You know, encryption and a decently strong password pretty much seals the deal on somebody physically stealing your data. There is no reason to not encrypt your home computer if you are so concerned.

>You know, encryption and a decently strong password pretty much seals the deal on somebody physically stealing your data.

Maybe stealing it and using the data. If someone swipes my drive the data is still gone. Even if it is inaccessible.

Re: Linus Torvalds on new Chromebook Aura UI

#49

Post by stevewilhelm »

wavephorm wrote: post #8

The "All-Web" paradigm is coming, folks. And it really doesn't matter how much you love your iPhone, or your Android, or Windows phone. Native apps are toast, in the long run. Your data is moving to the cloud -- your pictures, your music, your movies, and every document you write. It's all going up there, and local hard drives will be history within 3 years. And what that means is ALL software is heading there too. N…

"All-Web" makes hardware a commodity. Apple, Amazon, Microsoft, etc. have a huge incentive (literally billions of dollars of incentive) to keep the user experience on their devices better than that of any other device.

Native apps may be toast, but they won't go without a fight.

Re: Linus Torvalds on new Chromebook Aura UI

#50

Post by pjscott »

ableal wrote: post #43
moistgorilla wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Great, another prophet. Worst thing is, if you somehow are correct, you would not stop shoving it in people's faces how right you are. Cloud is not the future, not with the current US internet infrastructure at least. Also why would someone pay 10 dollars a month for 50 GB of space in the cloud when you can buy 1 TB portable hard drives for dirt cheap?

> Great, another prophet. Heh. "Pandora didn't get half the kicking around she deserved", as I think that R.A.Heinlein jokingly put it. (Not that I believe that GP is that prescient.)

It's Cassandra, actually, and she was pretty harmless. It's not like anybody believed her.
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