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Higher vehicle hoods significantly increase pedestrian deaths, study finds

arstechnica.com

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Re: Higher vehicle hoods significantly increase pedestrian deaths, study finds

#231

Post by jjav »

BobaFloutist wrote: post #109
jetrink wrote: post #54

My proposed regulation is to introduce a hazardous vehicle license for large trucks and SUVs. Everyone is automatically granted one alongside their normal drivers license, but if you're caught driving recklessly (weaving through traffic on the highway, aggressively tailgating, speeding through residential or urban areas), you lose it and you have to drive a normal-sized car. Perhaps there's a way to earn it back thro…

Just require a class A/B license to drive anything above...I don't know, 4000lbs? Exclude batteries from the weight if that becomes a problem for electric cars.

> Exclude batteries from the weight if that becomes a problem for electric cars.

Mass is mass, whether in the form of battery or frame metal.

While encouraging lighter cars would be a huge win, carving a massive exception to heavy EVs completely defeats the point.

Re: Higher vehicle hoods significantly increase pedestrian deaths, study finds

#232

Post by jjav »

FooBarBizBazz wrote: post #84
jetrink wrote: post #54

My proposed regulation is to introduce a hazardous vehicle license for large trucks and SUVs. Everyone is automatically granted one alongside their normal drivers license, but if you're caught driving recklessly (weaving through traffic on the highway, aggressively tailgating, speeding through residential or urban areas), you lose it and you have to drive a normal-sized car. Perhaps there's a way to earn it back thro…

I like the spirit, but don't like the unintended consequence that it would create a stigma around sedans -- "oh, those are the cars for the bad drivers". We need to do something that makes SUV drivers feel ridiculous and humiliated. Or, failing that, just make it expensive: Weight and size dependent tolls, say (using the fourth power of weight, possibly, to match road wear equations?). Or just fewer lanes in which th…

> I like the spirit, but don't like the unintended consequence that it would create a stigma around sedans

It doesn't need to be anything punitive, just make it that more training is required.

You start off with a basic license that allows for something like a 1.0 liter engine car (I know, also need to change regulations to encourage the manufacturing of small cars).

Then with more experience and more training you can level up to higher power and weight categories, if you want. The training needs to become more and more difficult (not paper DMV tests), that cuts out the people who want the 9000lb truck just for status since most people won't bother. If you need that 9000lb truck enough to go through the training, have at it.

Re: Higher vehicle hoods significantly increase pedestrian deaths, study finds

#233

Post by sporkland »

quadyeast wrote: post #158

The opaque tinted side windows make it hard to tell if the driver sees you at the pedestrian cross. I'm often forced to wait till they leave and they sometimes wait for me so ...

Illegal but not enforced in California. I say we let these people run a few more years and then basically revoke the license of anyone that has done this for a year. The front dark tinted window is nearly 100% correlated with reckless, aggressive driving for me.

Re: Higher vehicle hoods significantly increase pedestrian deaths, study finds

#234

Post by [deleted] »

rhuru wrote: post #157
baggachipz wrote: post #6

Yeah but the drivers get to cosplay as Rugged Men™. The only thing that'll reverse the trend and stop this from getting worse will be government regulation. Then come the cries of "Now they're taking our trucks!"

Common sense is the first casualty when any topic has political bias to it. This comment demonstrates that. Large vehicles are important part of American economy and mostly driven by blue collar workers doing their work. For example things like plumbing, construction site work etc. Now a days environment scientists and engineers too drive these large vehicles as they are very important for their day to day work. Not…

[deleted]

Re: Higher vehicle hoods significantly increase pedestrian deaths, study finds

#235

Post by jjav »

danaris wrote: post #140
FooBarBizBazz wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I like the spirit, but don't like the unintended consequence that it would create a stigma around sedans -- "oh, those are the cars for the bad drivers". We need to do something that makes SUV drivers feel ridiculous and humiliated. Or, failing that, just make it expensive: Weight and size dependent tolls, say (using the fourth power of weight, possibly, to match road wear equations?). Or just fewer lanes in which th…

If we're going to try to "punish" SUV drivers for driving those vehicles, then I think we need to both recognize and do some things: 1) We need to recognize that there's a wide variety of vehicles in the SUV category. Many of them have replaced (not supplemented, replaced , because they sell better and car companies are hyperoptimizing their profits like everyone else) old standards like station wagons and minivans i…

> We need to recognize that, at least for some SUVs, there are genuine, non-overcompensating use cases.

For the things I think of as SUVs, I don't think there is any legitimate use case to be honest.

Big SUVs often have less interior room than a sedan or station wagon so interior room is not a use case. They have way less cargo capacity than a pickup so that's not a use case either. They fit less people than a van, so fail again. They are top-heavy and not nimble, another fail. I don't understand the point of SUVs.

I definitely would not support any kind of SUV ban simply because I don't believe in bans, to each their own, but just make a SUV-license require a lot more training which will discourage most soccer-moms/dads from wanting one.

You say Subaru Outback though. I would have never called that a SUV. It's a wagon. I do see the Subaru website calls it a SUV, which I find weird. I guess the definition of SUV has broadened to mean just about anything.

Re: Higher vehicle hoods significantly increase pedestrian deaths, study finds

#236

Post by BobaFloutist »

jjav wrote: post #231
BobaFloutist wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just require a class A/B license to drive anything above...I don't know, 4000lbs? Exclude batteries from the weight if that becomes a problem for electric cars.

> Exclude batteries from the weight if that becomes a problem for electric cars. Mass is mass, whether in the form of battery or frame metal. While encouraging lighter cars would be a huge win, carving a massive exception to heavy EVs completely defeats the point.

Mass is mass, but electric cars of the same size tend to be heavier than their ICE counterparts. If the only goal is to keep cars light, then it completely defeats the point. If the goal is to keep cars smaller, and is at all informed by emissions than it makes sense to have at least part of a carve out for batteries.

Re: Higher vehicle hoods significantly increase pedestrian deaths, study finds

#237

Post by arh68 »

sickofparadox wrote: post #36
baggachipz wrote: post #6

Yeah but the drivers get to cosplay as Rugged Men™. The only thing that'll reverse the trend and stop this from getting worse will be government regulation. Then come the cries of "Now they're taking our trucks!"

It's government regulations that made trucks get this big, most people simply buy what is available in the form factor they like. Trucks are the most popular form factor in the United States (with pickups a close second)[1], and the manufacturers keep making the cars bigger because of the poorly written CAFE laws[2]. I, and I suspect most Americans with pickups, would prefer to purchase one the size of a '90s F-150 a…

Trucks sure are popular, but gov't regulations didn't "make" them big.

Given the popularity of F-250s / 2500s, which hardly meet any CAFE standard, the truckers don't yearn for the Ranger. They like 12mpg turbo diesel. We could repeal CAFE, get Ford to make them, but they still wouldn't sell. Tacoma loyalists keep the mid-size truck alive, but they're just a small fraction of 1500/2500 buyers.

People like big trucks, and that's fine: but why blame it on the gov't ?

Re: Higher vehicle hoods significantly increase pedestrian deaths, study finds

#238

Post by grecy »

1970-01-01 wrote: post #176
grecy wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Cybertruck is lighter than the Rivian and the F-150 Lightning. It's around 3,000lbs lighter than the electric Hummer. It's also lower than all of them. https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a46031051/2024-tesla-cyber...

The height is adjustable via air springs. It can ride lower, higher, or equal to those.

It can't ride at either of it's two highest settings when going above 15 and 25 mph respectively.

Re: Higher vehicle hoods significantly increase pedestrian deaths, study finds

#239

Post by acdha »

s1artibartfast wrote: post #181
acdha wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The average American truck buyer picked it as a lifestyle accessory - it’s not like there was a huge shift in the percentage of trades jobs over the last few decades! Liability would be one way to encourage expressing that fashion aesthetic in other ways.

Liability already exists. what next?

No, not effectively. Drivers are given extreme deference by law enforcement and in lawsuits where it’s usually assumed that the victim was at fault unless video evidence exists and is immediately available, and concepts like contributory negligence are often used to reduce legal responsibility without regard for the relative damage levels. Insurance is required, but the coverage levels are low so it’s common for the people who do successfully sue often get less than they need for ongoing treatment and support.

We can’t change everything all at once but requiring more comprehensive coverage in general and especially for the most dangerous vehicles would be a good start.

Re: Higher vehicle hoods significantly increase pedestrian deaths, study finds

#240

Post by kspacewalk2 »

grecy wrote: post #132
kspacewalk2 wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Cybetruck's obnoxious hood height[0] and curb weight[1] all but guarantees that it's dangerous for pedestrians. Not that singling out Cybetruck is completely fair, all large EVs are strictly worse for pedestrian safety due to their weight. [0] https://www.forbes.com/sites/petercohan/2023/12/05/with-litt... [1] https://www.autoweek.com/news/a46013576/tesla-cybertruck-spe...

The Cybertruck is lighter than the Rivian and the F-150 Lightning. It's around 3,000lbs lighter than the electric Hummer. It's also lower than all of them. https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a46031051/2024-tesla-cyber...

Slightly lighter than Rivian R1 and roughly same weight as F-150 Lightning. But I agree, quite possibly not the absolute most dangerous vehicle on the road.
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