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Framework Laptop 16 Review

phoronix.com

191–200 of 404 posts

Re: Framework Laptop 16 Review

#191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

my thinkpad keyboard from 2014 definitely has and yes, I do say that even though I also have a keychron keyboard for my desktop

> and it feels amazing If you used the ones from 2012 and earlier, you would find the 2014 laptop keyboard only passable...

I did use older keyboards like the one on the x220 as well and while the feeling was a little bit better, I just can't use a keyboard without a numpad (reason I am not using 14 or 13 inch laptops) and I also think the keycaps on the newer model are superior

Re: Framework Laptop 16 Review

#193

I wish they deliver good keyboard as well, like Thinkpads X201 or similar have. I am happy owner of modded X201 with updated screen, motherboard, and so on. It's not on a cheap side, but I'm happy to pay that price _only_ for the keyboard option. It's so cool. Folks back then knew what was important.

I have not used a Windows laptop outside of Razer and maybe Surface in many years. How do those Thinkpad keyboards compare to new Macbook Pro keyboards? I've always found the Macbook Pro keyboards to be "fine," but I'm curious if I am actually missing out on a better experience.

> I've always found the Macbook Pro keyboards to be "fine,"

I haven't bought a (non-phone) computer made by Apple since, and due to, the MBP 2017 keyboard fiasco. It was the single most shitty and unusable keyboard I have had a displeasure working on, and I've owned some super cheap entry laptops in the past.

To say that it was crap, trash, garbage, joke, spit in consumer's face feels like a laughably low effort on expressing how useless it was. I bought this laptop as a pre-order before general availability and reported issues to Apple before all the media shitstorm began. Support reps have expressed their concerns and assured me over the phone that it has to be an isolated problem with an individual unit. I've sent the laptop for servicing within a 2 weeks since purchase. They replaced the keyboard and, for some reason, also the mainboard and screen and sent it back. Exact same issues but before I got the mostly-replaced device, issues with the butterfly keyboard already caught media attention and it was a hot topic.

I was traveling with a laptop and a mechanical Keychron keyboard, ffs. I used external keyboard during flights, at Starbucks and in other public places. Any attempt to use built-in butterfly joke of a keyboard was so frustrating that carrying an external keyboard was a reasonable trade-off.

Apple later parted ways with $50 million to settle the class-action. US-based buyers got up to $395 (I got nothing in EU) but still ended up with non-resellable devices. Jony Ive probably got a great bonus for this stunt.

I'm happy for you that you have experienced only "fine" keyboards on MBPs. Would I have enemies, I wouldn't wish the misfortune of having to use MBP 2017 on any of them.

Re: Framework Laptop 16 Review

#194
post #2

I'm happy to answer any questions folks have on this product.

any plans for upgrades not just for the webcam and mic but also the speakers (though side instead of down maybe problematic)? since they did not get much praise from LTT

Re: Framework Laptop 16 Review

#195
post #2

I'm happy to answer any questions folks have on this product.

When will it be available in Sweden? I followed the prompt on the website and signed up for the newsletter, but I got so much marketing spam that was totally irrelevant to my one and only question that I had to unsubscribe.

rest of the EU is supported via reshipping https://knowledgebase.frame.work/en_us/eu-unsupported-SJByUb...

Re: Framework Laptop 16 Review

#196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Make sure you are on the latest PPD - this matters and provides a noticeable improvement. https://copr.fedorainfracloud.org/coprs/mariolimonciello/pow... and you are on at least kernel 6.6.12.

The defaults should work. What’s the point in buying a Linux-branded laptop if they can’t get the basics right?

It's not Linux-branded to be fair (they label it as a "DIY" device that ships with no OS), but yeah.. I'm not really one to deviate too far from the defaults on a device I use for work.

Re: Framework Laptop 16 Review

#197
post #179
post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I love my FW13 too. I just wish it had more options for components. I can of course pick my own SSD and RAM configuration but that's true of every Lenovo laptop. I wish I could get a 4K screen, an eInk screen, a touchscreen, a Dvorak keyboard, a OLED keyboard, an IMU/GPS/barometer expansion module, a pico projector expansion module, a software-defined-radio expansion module, a larger aperture webcam module, an IR web…

We've seen Microcontroller, SDR, and IR Expansion Cards from the community! We'd definitely love to see some of the even more complex ones though, and expect that as the community continues to mature and grow, some will make it through: https://community.frame.work/c/developer-program/85

Yes, I've seen those though unfortunately I'm not a hardware engineer and would have a hard time reproducing them. Even if I could figure out how to get a PCB made from a KiCAD file I wouldn't be able to do the surface-mount soldering without botching everything.

I'd love to be able to just pay for them and buy them and then get rolling with software :)

Re: Framework Laptop 16 Review

#199
post #166

I'll chime in and say that I love my FW13. It's a great machine. I got the DIY kit and had my 7yo put it together. It was straightforward with a little help from dad (even installing Ubuntu!). Now we fight over who gets to use it.

I love my FW13 too. I just wish it had more options for components. I can of course pick my own SSD and RAM configuration but that's true of every Lenovo laptop. I wish I could get a 4K screen, an eInk screen, a touchscreen, a Dvorak keyboard, a OLED keyboard, an IMU/GPS/barometer expansion module, a pico projector expansion module, a software-defined-radio expansion module, a larger aperture webcam module, an IR web…

> I wish I could get a 4K screen, an eInk screen, a touchscreen, a Dvorak keyboard, a OLED keyboard, an IMU/GPS/barometer expansion module, a pico projector expansion module, a software-defined-radio expansion module, a larger aperture webcam module, an IR webcam module, a depth camera webcam module, an Arduino expansion module, an IR emitter expansion module that controls TVs, etc etc etc.

> But nobody seems interested in making this stuff. I guess the community that uses Framework laptops isn't really capable of that level of hardware engineering (me included) and the companies in China doing hardware haven't caught onto making stuff for Framework.

I relate to your sentiment of wanting tons of modules, but I'm going to disagree on the skills of the community.

For some of these options (4k/eink screens for eg), you need such a panel to be available (panelook to search -> aliexpress/ebay to buy). SDRs, IMUs & sensors could be doable relatively "easily" if they interface via USB/PCIE.

There are lots of hardware tinkerers in youtube, hackaday and of course even here on HN. I'm a mechanical engineer with some electrical/electronics knowledge, and I could likely make a half-decent module if I had the time/money/reason/ethusiasm for it. There's a guy who's turned an iPad screen into the FW13 display (on the framework community). There are probably dozens of people who may read this comment who are far more skilled than I am.

If you are very keen to do this yourself, you might want to start with learning 3d modelling and building up from that (from a mechanical side). 3d printing metals with something like SLS is commercially (relatively) easy and (imo) accessible compared to say 10-20 years back.

Re: Framework Laptop 16 Review

#200
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

USB4 support is present on the rear left and right Expansion Card slots on our Ryzen-powered Framework Laptop 13 and Framework Laptop 16.

Ah perfect, the descriptipn of the usb-c expansion module confused me a little bit.

Reviews seem to suggest that AMD has proper eGPU support too on those ports, fwiw
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