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Tell HN: Hacker News now supports IPv6

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Re: Tell HN: Hacker News now supports IPv6

#201

Post by SOLAR_FIELDS »

iknowstuff wrote: post #185
orangeboats wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I am so surprised by the hate for IPv6 in this thread. I find that HN views IPv6 noticeably more harshly than many other communities I have been a part of (e.g. networking subreddits and gaming communities). I am curious of the reason behind this.

Developers who don’t care to learn how/why things work, have gone by without it, and are upset that they gotta learn more now because it works differently.

I think it’s a bit more nuanced than that. The UX of IPv6 is still decidedly inferior. Typing a curl command etc or in general manually typing and remembering IPs is decidedly more difficult with IPv6 vs IPv4. I think IPv6 needs either a killer command line tool or aliasing scheme to overcome that stigma.

Re: Tell HN: Hacker News now supports IPv6

#202

Post by SOLAR_FIELDS »

orangeboats wrote: post #190
iknowstuff wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Developers who don’t care to learn how/why things work, have gone by without it, and are upset that they gotta learn more now because it works differently.

I just hope that people won't repeat the same "I wish IPv6 were just IPv4 with extra octets" viewpoint again... The use of hex is very helpful when you're calculating subnets. You want a /48 prefix? Just take the first 3 hextets. /56? First 3 and a half hextets. /64? First 4 hextets.

This is an excellent point because entire tools exist with ipv4 to calculate subnets and unless you do base math all the time you’re usually using them to figure out stuff like CIDR overlaps

Re: Tell HN: Hacker News now supports IPv6

#203

Post by neilalexander »

SOLAR_FIELDS wrote: post #201
iknowstuff wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Developers who don’t care to learn how/why things work, have gone by without it, and are upset that they gotta learn more now because it works differently.

I think it’s a bit more nuanced than that. The UX of IPv6 is still decidedly inferior. Typing a curl command etc or in general manually typing and remembering IPs is decidedly more difficult with IPv6 vs IPv4. I think IPv6 needs either a killer command line tool or aliasing scheme to overcome that stigma.

The aliasing scheme is called DNS.

Re: Tell HN: Hacker News now supports IPv6

#204

Post by GoblinSlayer »

mkl wrote: post #79
p1mrx wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IPvFoo author here. The problem is that there's no way to obtain the (hostname, ip) stream from Chrome/Firefox without requesting the "all websites" permission. In theory, browser vendors could define a narrowly-scoped permission that only reports (hostname, ip), or roll this functionality into the browser UI, but neither seems likely to happen. I made IPvFoo to promote IPv6 adoption, and wouldn't consider selling it…

The danger with extension acquisitions is malicious buyers, who use their ability to run arbitrary code to steal credit card numbers or credentials, insert or replace ads, run cryptocurrency mining, etc. For malicious purposes number of installations is the important thing, not how clonable the extension is.

You can do those in private windows, there's separate permission for those: https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/extensions-private-brow...

Miners need the least amount of permissions anyway.

Re: Tell HN: Hacker News now supports IPv6

#205

Post by commandersaki »

orangeboats wrote: post #184
kuon wrote: post #182

I am so surprised by the hate for IPv6 in this thread. I have been deploying IPv6 for more than ten years and it really improve many situations (beside larger addresses). I have to admit, there is a learning curve. But I want to encourage everybody involved in configuring computers to learn. Also I want to rent about Cisco not using /64 for link local by default, thus being incompatible with BSD systems. Link local m…

>I am so surprised by the hate for IPv6 in this thread. I find that HN views IPv6 noticeably more harshly than many other communities I have been a part of (e.g. networking subreddits and gaming communities). I am curious of the reason behind this.

My reason: IPv6 failed to fulfill its original objective.

Re: Tell HN: Hacker News now supports IPv6

#206

Post by wut42 »

orangeboats wrote: post #190
iknowstuff wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Developers who don’t care to learn how/why things work, have gone by without it, and are upset that they gotta learn more now because it works differently.

I just hope that people won't repeat the same "I wish IPv6 were just IPv4 with extra octets" viewpoint again... The use of hex is very helpful when you're calculating subnets. You want a /48 prefix? Just take the first 3 hextets. /56? First 3 and a half hextets. /64? First 4 hextets.

The thread posted yesterday about Czech Republic's IPv4 deprecation plans had at least a comment about IPv4 with extras octets. I am pretty sure that even once IPv4 will be fully dead and replaced by v6, people will still rant about that.

Re: Tell HN: Hacker News now supports IPv6

#207

Post by tolien »

orangeboats wrote: post #190
iknowstuff wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Developers who don’t care to learn how/why things work, have gone by without it, and are upset that they gotta learn more now because it works differently.

I just hope that people won't repeat the same "I wish IPv6 were just IPv4 with extra octets" viewpoint again... The use of hex is very helpful when you're calculating subnets. You want a /48 prefix? Just take the first 3 hextets. /56? First 3 and a half hextets. /64? First 4 hextets.

> I just hope that people won't repeat the same "I wish IPv6 were just IPv4 with extra octets" viewpoint again...

The new Godwin's Law, any discussion about IPv6 will inevitably lead to someone suggesting IPv4 with extra octets.

Re: Tell HN: Hacker News now supports IPv6

#208

Post by bmacho »

ffomni wrote: post #131
bmacho wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not what GP said. Of course IPv4 devices wouldn't be able to use IPv6 addresses, that would be impossible. But it is possible to "keep" IPv4 addresses, just make a.b.c.d to correspond 0.0.a.b.c.d.

First of all, the 4 in IPv4 has nothing to do with its addresses typically being represented in dotted 4-octett notation. That's a coincidence. Each address is a 32 bit number, that's it. Early versions of IPv4 as well as some of the experimental IPv3 drafts actually used 128 bits. In IPv6 there are 128 bits for each address. Nothing to do with 6, which is just a version number. Second, IPv6 is not just about address…

You and Plasmoid completely misunderstood dheera and me. I failed to clarify this misunderstanding explicitly (I still don't see where does it come from), so I do it now.

> I grew up with IPv4 (1.2.3.4) and I was expecting IPv6 to just be 1.2.3.4.5.6 with backward compatibility so that 1.2.3.4 would just be 0.0.1.2.3.4 and the 1.2.3.4 dude wouldn't need to change their address.

As you can see, dheera did not state that IPv4 or IPv6 work with strings. They just said that they wished/expected the trivial extension of the IPv4 protocol, with the same notation, and preserving the existing IPv4 addresses. (These are 2 distinct wishes.) Acknowledging that this did not happen.

Nor dheera nor me posted any half truth or plain wrong information.

Re: Tell HN: Hacker News now supports IPv6

#209

Post by bilekas »

schroeding wrote: post #110
Plasmoid wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Another person who does not understand IPv4. IPv4 isn't a text based protocol where IP addresses are parsed like DNS. It's a binary protocol where addresses are recorded in binary and adding more address space WOULD BE A BREAKING CHANGE.

For a practical demonstration: That's the reason decimal IPs work, too - i.e. http://3520653007/ is the same as http://209.216.230.207/ (and both will go to HN) - it's all just nice formating for our human brains. Nothing would stop us from formatting IPv6 the IPv4 way except the monstrous length of the resulting address.

My whole life I went without knowing decimal IPs were a thing..

Re: Tell HN: Hacker News now supports IPv6

#210

Post by dajonker »

ta1243 wrote: post #154
mike_d wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ARIN recently handed out a /16 allocation to Capital One. That is one 65,025th of all of IPv6. A reasonable sized /32 allocation would have allowed for giving every ATM they operate worldwide its own globally routable /48.

I find the insistence of using /64s everywhere for networks frustrating. Any network larger than a /112 seems crazy, that's already 65k IPs per subnet. A /104 for every normal end user (256 subnets per user), or a /80 for massive companies like Capital One (4 billion subnets) should be more than enough.

It's not just about the number of devices. Stateless Address Autoconfiguration for example basically needs a /64 subnet.
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