Incredibox - Background music for programming.

Hm. There is quite a bit of misinformation (I like to think it was done unintentionally) that your comment caused when people replied to you. The biggest one being that the US 'invented' 'electronic dance music'.

I can sit here and write an overly, but necessary long reply or recommend a couple of books. I'll do the latter, all of them by Simon Reynolds: Generation Ecstasy: Into the World of Techno and Rave Culture; Retromania: Pop Culture's Addiction to Its Own Past.

Music history is filled with ambiguities and nebulous, complex definitions that have changed throughout history. What's more, how electronic dance music got from point A to B to C to D to E, and so on and so forth, usually sounds unintuitive to people who listen to mostly only very few music styles. A linear and extremely compressed timeline of electronic (dance) music can probably start as early as Kraftwerk in the early 70s, then NEU! and a lot of so-called 'krautrock', which morphed into things such as Joy Division, who is said to have influenced rave/club culture. Interestingly, the word 'rave' is actually 1960s British slang for modern day-like, club-like loud parties. These loans (both linguistically and musically from all periods in time) remain very common across all of music and makes it even more complex to explain. Anyway, the whole Hacienda club scene influenced club music in the 80s, especially when Ian Curtis died and New Order adopted a sound that allegedly Curtis had already thought of in the late 70s. The Human League shares a somewhat similar music development in the sense that early Human League incorporated more 'rock' elements with 'electronic' ones, and then mostly switched to pure 'electronic' elements. With the help of hip hop (borrowing and sampling music to form their own music), a type of 'explosion' in electronic music occurred. There were some artists already making electronic dance music but it hit mainstream in the early 80s when hip hop started sampling from other artists and using non-traditional (for that time) ways of making music with electronic equipment.

You get bands such as Duran Duran to DJs 'mixing' to, basically, C+C Music Factory. Then comes probably the epitome of rave and electronic dance music: UK garage, dnb, 2-step, jungle, etc.; that all-encompassing term 'rave music'. This is probably when every type of electronic and electronic dance music was created and the rest is history.

See, the problem is that by the 80s, electronic dance music had already been invented and various locations took those ideas at the same time, so people sometimes emphasise New York (electro), Chicago or Detroit (house), and at the point the music from these places 'sounded' more like what we relate to 'house music' now, many other places (in the UK, especially) were doing the same thing. If we look back at Chicago and Detroit before this time, they still had house, but it sounded like funk or disco or dance music with upgraded gear. In other words, it was funk, disco, or dance music using more electronic sounding equipment that we now equate to an '80s sound'. It wasn't electronic music using dance elements. It was dance music using electronic elements.

The funny thing about the States is that in the 90s, electronic music switched to a mainstream emphasis. There were still raves in the States, interesting DJs, and a thriving club scene, but it was underground. The American 90s were characterized by the rise of underground 'indie music'/'rock'/'grunge'/'alternative' music. As much as I hate to admit it (because I don't like them), but Nirvana is a good example of this, as are bands such as Pavement, Sonic Youth, Soundgarden, and Alice in Chains.

If that makes sense.

agreed. 3LAU is better than Kap...Kap's stuff just feels too 'bro' for me. I like more traditional EDM either way.

You do now there is a place for rich media on the web and it is very popular. Don't you?

I wrote a reply but was using this HN app for the iPhone and, of course, it didn't go through.

We disagree on a couple of contentious issues, which is fine :)

I'll try to re-cap very briefly (Argh! No time for long, deep conversations, anymore!)

I think the keyword is 'meaningful'. I think Reynolds would agree that music genres and movements aren't linear or unorganic. They start, have hiccups, move and are flexible. They're dynamic. As you kind of alluded to in your edit. So, I guess we half-agree (?) on this.

The African thing is a bit of a stretch, no? The comparisons I made are in-tune with each other and had stronger (and direct) ties and similarities. This is the tricky part of comparing conceptual/theoretical ties within music periods and sound, from a musicology point of view. The treatment of sound within my comparisons are much closer, I think.

Also, remember that the 'electronic dance music' that is now popular in the States wasn't so in the 90s--it was underground--whereas you can make a case for it being popular in the UK in the 90s. If you hear people like Kevin Shields talk about music in the US vs. the UK back in the 90s and 80s, he talks about how the UK had a larger audience that was 'thirstier' for newer sounds and it was more accessible to 'mainstream audiences', whereas the States had a strong disparate audience and division.

For example, talk to anybody in the US and ask them if they think The Smiths is mainstream. They will tell you they are not. Yet The Smiths was an extremely popular band in the UK.

The same sort of thing occurs now in the radio up until now. So-called 'indie' or 'underground' music in the States is popular or listened to at a wider scale in the UK and even Canada.

Wow, incredibly addicting. I don't think it is something I would play around with every day, but I spent about an hour trying out different combinations.