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Big Data's Big Problem: Little Talent

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Re: Big Data's Big Problem: Little Talent

#11

I'm not sure that the kinds of employees that this article describes will ever be a large number. There could be more of them in the future, but someone who is top-notch at all of statistics, programming, and data-presentation has long been less common than someone who's good at one or two of those. Companies might consider looking at better ways to build teams that combine talent that exists, instead of pining for m…

I completely take most of your points, but I think that pretty much all quantitative PhD's are going to be close to "data scientists". Given that stats and explaining your research are requirements, all that's left is to train them to program, which a lot of people are already doing. As a matter of fact, since I heard about this big data stuff I've been honing my skills in this area, in case the hype actually manifes…

_delirium's post acknowledges your point but is looking for an even rarer person:

"There could be more of them in the future, but someone who is top-notch at all of statistics, programming, and data-presentation has long been less common than someone who's good at one or two of those".

Someone that can program, understands statistics and can present the data in an appealing manner without losing significant fidelity. Many people underestimate the difficulty and skill required in presenting data in a way that makes sense and also actually says something.

There is a significant gap between presenting data that is satisfactory to a research advisor and something that a business person with barely enough time to think can grasp without misconception.

Re: Big Data's Big Problem: Little Talent

#13
post #7

As an engineer who's investing in developing "deep expertise in statistics and machine learning" I can only stand to benefit from it, but something about the current wave of Big Data hype makes me instinctively a bit wary. Does this skills shortage really exist to the extent claimed? are there really enough people out there who would know what to do with a 'data scientist' if they were able to hire one? I see more ta…

At a conference I attended last month, one of the keynotes estimated that there might be 250 people in the country with the skills need to build non-trivial, ontology-based data systems. Even if that is an wild exaggeration, it is at least evidence of a perceived shortage.

Also note that an ability to transfer domain experts' knowledge into working models is at least as important as the Stats+ML bits.

Re: Big Data's Big Problem: Little Talent

#14
Basically a solution looking for a problem.

They are right, the complexity that big data caters for requires expertise at both technical and business level that would be costly (though may not be at infrastructure level). In the current economy, it looks even more difficult where businesses want to squeeze the maximum out of dollar investment.

IMO, its too early stage for big data solution adoption. However stage could be set for startups who can come up innovative solution that brings the cost level down together with simple and useful easy to grasp solutions.

Re: Big Data's Big Problem: Little Talent

#15
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're absolutely right. That said, I don't buy that big-data is as revolutionary as the Internet. While in theory, every single business can collect data and optimize based on what they see, this is way too complex for most businesses to deal with. While big data has certainly been critical for the business model of ad-based startups, I don't see it being used in other industries. People keep alluding to data-driven…

This technology will change the world more than the Internet or any other technology in human history. You're right that adoption is very slow. I'm convinced that businesses could save trillions of dollars by applying existing weak AI to their problems. Why aren't they doing it ? For one thing there's a huge gulf between the average business person's understanding of what is possible and what actually is. On the othe…

Slightly off-topic, but your website breaks after visiting the RDMS page, as all the other links seem to be relative, so they attempt to go to pages such as /products/people.html

Re: Big Data's Big Problem: Little Talent

#16
post #7

As an engineer who's investing in developing "deep expertise in statistics and machine learning" I can only stand to benefit from it, but something about the current wave of Big Data hype makes me instinctively a bit wary. Does this skills shortage really exist to the extent claimed? are there really enough people out there who would know what to do with a 'data scientist' if they were able to hire one? I see more ta…

As someone in the big data field on the ground (VP of Engineering). Let me give you my thoughts on it.

Your impression about the hype is correct. There are a lot of vendors offering BIG solutions, if you pay them BIGGER money. Where I used to translate the word enterprise to $$, now I translate Big Data to $$$$$$$.

When I'm hiring, I don't go looking for Big Data people, because generally they don't exist. Statistics is a really great general addition to a programmers toolkit. Machine Learning is valuable as well, although in my experience the application is more limited. What this article doesn't mention is a whole host of other skills required.

Modeling, and not just a formal mathematical model, but applying any type of model to your data to get insight. Check out the model-thinking class on coursera.

Exploratory Data Analysis, much different skill than confirmatory statistics.

Design of Experiments, specialized subfield within statistics.

Logistics, how to setup, maintain, and maximally utilize an efficient distributed cluster and build a pipeline getting your data to the cluster, cleaning it, building it into a model, and then extracting insight and delivering that end value.

Those are a couple of the skills at a high level. At a more nuts and bolts level, Hadoop is the defacto standard for Big Data. Learning how to build a data pipeline out of the Linux tool chain is very common in the data science world.

The overall value stream for Big Data is deep and wide. Most companies don't have expertise in much of these, and so at the current time you have to learn them yourself or find a company focused on building a team around it.

If you are just learning this yourself, you'll probably get an academic knowledge. If you want to make yourself valuable in the marketplace, you'll really want to get hands on experience. Knowing a z-score is one thing, building a process to gather data and compute a model against it is a whole different ball game. As the article mentions, if you have nice clean data it's easy to apply a model. If you have messy ugly data from 20 different vendors and 200 clients with various failures, anomalies, and you have to figure out what type of model is helpful, oh and you have a deadline because for 500th time someone promised something impossible to the client, then you have something closer to what Big Data is today.

* grammar edits

Re: Big Data's Big Problem: Little Talent

#17
post #13
post #7

As an engineer who's investing in developing "deep expertise in statistics and machine learning" I can only stand to benefit from it, but something about the current wave of Big Data hype makes me instinctively a bit wary. Does this skills shortage really exist to the extent claimed? are there really enough people out there who would know what to do with a 'data scientist' if they were able to hire one? I see more ta…

At a conference I attended last month, one of the keynotes estimated that there might be 250 people in the country with the skills need to build non-trivial, ontology-based data systems. Even if that is an wild exaggeration, it is at least evidence of a perceived shortage. Also note that an ability to transfer domain experts' knowledge into working models is at least as important as the Stats+ML bits.

I'd say the current academic research in ML is not oriented towards producing people who can use ML in real applications.

I've hovered around the periphery of a world-leading ML research group, and the first takeaway I have is that 7 years ago I thought the stuff they were working on was going to take the world by storm, but looking back, I can say it hasn't.

This group does a number of research projects on narrowly defined topics. 4 out of 5 of these projects try out some refinement of the method that doesn't really work. Maybe 1 out of 5, if that, point to a real improvement.

The big thing that's lacking are serious attempts to push the state of the art by attacking a problem holistically and "taking no prisoners" -- yet this is exactly the kind of thinking necessary to commercialize ML.

The leader of the group got tenure so he thinks everything is going OK. He won't even offer an analysis of why this technology hasn't been widely commercialized. PhD students from this group usually interview at Google, Microsoft and Facebook but these three employers are the only ones they consider as an alternative to academic employment.

Re: Big Data's Big Problem: Little Talent

#18
post #13
post #7

As an engineer who's investing in developing "deep expertise in statistics and machine learning" I can only stand to benefit from it, but something about the current wave of Big Data hype makes me instinctively a bit wary. Does this skills shortage really exist to the extent claimed? are there really enough people out there who would know what to do with a 'data scientist' if they were able to hire one? I see more ta…

At a conference I attended last month, one of the keynotes estimated that there might be 250 people in the country with the skills need to build non-trivial, ontology-based data systems. Even if that is an wild exaggeration, it is at least evidence of a perceived shortage. Also note that an ability to transfer domain experts' knowledge into working models is at least as important as the Stats+ML bits.

I agree with Paul's comment. The 250 number feels low to me, but that is applying a specific model. Typically people come with some set of favorite models, and many of them provide that vast majority of the benefit a business needs. Especially when the current model in use is slipshod and busted at best.

Re: Big Data's Big Problem: Little Talent

#19
post #2

Actually that is silly -- McKensey should now that there is and will never be a talent shortage. There will only be shortage of talent at a particular wage rate. If the companies paid newly graduated 'data-scientists' (what other kind of scientists are there? The tea-leaf reading kind?) 200k/year then they would have a lot more. It is pretty simple economics.

Companies already do pay close to $200k/year for entry level data scientists.

(what other kind of scientists are there? The tea-leaf reading kind?)

"Data scientist" refers to the guy who can set up a hadoop cluster, do statistics on TBs worth of data, derive useful conclusions and speed it up by tweaking the low level data formats or microoptimizing the calculation.

The issue is rarely paying these guys an extra $20k, it's simply finding them.

Setting up some lasers and a photonic crystal, imaging the output, making a graph in excel or matlab and drawing conclusions is a different skillset. Someone who can do the latter is a scientist who uses data, but he is not a data scientist.

Re: Big Data's Big Problem: Little Talent

#20

I'm not sure that the kinds of employees that this article describes will ever be a large number. There could be more of them in the future, but someone who is top-notch at all of statistics, programming, and data-presentation has long been less common than someone who's good at one or two of those. Companies might consider looking at better ways to build teams that combine talent that exists, instead of pining for m…

I see this in software dev consulting, and it's probably in many other fields as well too.

I see companies looking for one person who's a highly-skilled DBA, sysadmin, developer and who can interact affably with all levels of people in a company, including customers, at the drop of a hat. Often it's because they had one 'magical' person who did all that, though usually not very well, and the next person (or team) who comes in after on that project has to deal with a bundle of undocumented crap that never really 'worked', but worked well enough to keep some people happy.

This scenario has been surprisingly common, and I worked with a company last year who was committed enough to hire dedicated dba and sysadmin positions, vs continuing to rely on app devs to handle all that stuff. The separation of concerns has worked out pretty well, though at first there was some concern about the cost of adding 'dedicated' people. In reality, all that work was being done anyway, often in ways that weren't terribly understandable by anyone outside the project.

The time it takes to get feature X done, tested, db upgraded, rolled out, servers maintained, patches applied, etc... is going to be roughly the same. If that's going to take, say, 100 hours, it's either 3 weeks of one person, or 1 week of 3 people. It's not worked out quite that cut-and-dried, but it's coming close. And the ability for each person/team to focus on their core skills and let someone else handle the "other stuff" has meant that, generally, the quality of things is better all around.

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