Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

The failure of self-checkout technology

bbc.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

451–460 of 621 posts

Re: The failure of self-checkout technology

#451

Post by Broken_Hippo »

MarketingJason wrote: post #434

The weight check slows the whole process down and I find I have to make sure I grab items with the cart-side hand or the system thinks I am trying to drop the item in the bag without scanning. Worst of all is the receipt check after the process - looking at you Costco. It feels like checking pockets in a diamond mine. If I am going to be doing all the work to save the store money they should loose the right to check…

I mean... Differences in location. I'm in Norway.

Most places have turned off the weight balance on the two sides, so it is no longer an issue.

I don't have a receipt check, but I do remember walmart did that before I moved ~10 years ago - those Walmarts didn't have self-checkouts, so it definitely isn't because of those. Stores thought this was good before self-checkouts were everywhere.

My mother once refused. They harassed her, and she ended up yelling. I cannot recall where this was, however, since there were not a Costco in the area.

I do - at some stores - get a random check, where they check a few items to make sure they were scanned. And then most of the time, I scan my receipt to get out of the check out area.

Re: The failure of self-checkout technology

#452

Post by dr_dshiv »

MarketingJason wrote: post #434

The weight check slows the whole process down and I find I have to make sure I grab items with the cart-side hand or the system thinks I am trying to drop the item in the bag without scanning. Worst of all is the receipt check after the process - looking at you Costco. It feels like checking pockets in a diamond mine. If I am going to be doing all the work to save the store money they should loose the right to check…

They don't do weight checks in the Netherlands. The process is super efficient. They have certain reasons to have a human check out your load before accepting payment (weight might be a part of it? But probably not). You must scan your receipt to leave. So far as I understand, I think it works really well here. They probably catch enough serial shoplifters to make it work.

My guess is that the "featurism" of the weight check was promoted so much that they feel weird just relying on the tendency of people to be honest. But people do tend to be honest (especially when there is a small chance of being caught)

Re: The failure of self-checkout technology

#453

Post by bombcar »

gmcharlt wrote: post #345
bombcar wrote: post #318

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Our library has self checkout and no anti-theft, but it still uses barcodes. No doubt if they were rolling out a system today they’d use RFID instead, but the absolute massive inertia from millions of barcodes books throughout the system must be huge.

That inertia is indeed huge. For example, if your library uses RFID but also shares a catalog and their books with other libraries, they'll still need barcode labels (with the same number that's encoded on the tag) so that the other libraries can deal with the items. Barcode scanners are ubiquitous in libraries; RFID readers, not so much. Also, one of the promises of RFID for libraries has not panned out very cleanly…

So many of these "technological solutions" end up being "spherical cow" type things.

RFID might speed up checkout at a library by a small fraction, but you still have the issue that most patrons check out a book or two, you still have to check that the DVD is in the case either way, and the self-checkouts aren't backing up anyway.

(Similarly most libraries have given up on fines, at least around here - the overhead of dealing with them and "scaring" patrons away was much worse than the people actively "stealing" books.)

Not to even get to barcodes (like CVS files) are quite interoperable, and you can relatively easily change one barcode system to another, just my importing the data. RFID readers often need specific RFID tags and it locks you to a vendor (who often promptly goes out of business). Over time things like that get noticed.

Re: The failure of self-checkout technology

#454

Post by hackan »

krastanov wrote: post #367
downut wrote: post #301

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just find it almost impossible to believe that you regularly buy vegetables or other bulk goods via checkout and have few or no problems. How about that bar code label on the spinach/parsley/cilantro? It's paper and it gets watered regularly so it is not uncommon for it to be illegible, even to the expert parser, the human. Those stickers do fall off. Is every brussel sprout going to have a sticker? Jalapenos? Okra…

I do not know what to tell you, I have never had any of the problems you list (I live in the Northeast, but I doubt that matters). Apple-sized things have little stickers, smaller things are batched with a barcode, and when somehow these fail, typing the name (or synonym) takes less than 10 seconds.

Indeed, you just start typing and usually 3 letters is enough to click something at the screen. Of course, this depends greatly in the buyer being... honorable, so I can understand if it doesn't work in many places.

Re: The failure of self-checkout technology

#455

Post by Zandikar »

MarketingJason wrote: post #434

The weight check slows the whole process down and I find I have to make sure I grab items with the cart-side hand or the system thinks I am trying to drop the item in the bag without scanning. Worst of all is the receipt check after the process - looking at you Costco. It feels like checking pockets in a diamond mine. If I am going to be doing all the work to save the store money they should loose the right to check…

They'll complain/look bewildered but little will come of it (probably) if you just do it once and weren't rude. However they can (not necessarily will, but can) revoke your membership for it, which you'll discover when you try to use the card at checkout or online. YMMV of course, but then checking the receipt is something you agreed to when signing on as a member. It really probably depends on how much of a scene it makes and if that stores stop loss dept takes note, which is likely tied to the value/fullness of the stuff in your cart.

I've done it before when busy, the line was long and I just needed tp (I was fortunate Costco was essentially my closest grocery store at the time). The girl doing receipt check looked non plussed and "Sir'd" me, I just smiled held up the receipt, told her have a nice day and kept going. No issue. Full cart might actually get a response though.

Re: The failure of self-checkout technology

#456

Post by n3dm »

MarketingJason wrote: post #434

The weight check slows the whole process down and I find I have to make sure I grab items with the cart-side hand or the system thinks I am trying to drop the item in the bag without scanning. Worst of all is the receipt check after the process - looking at you Costco. It feels like checking pockets in a diamond mine. If I am going to be doing all the work to save the store money they should loose the right to check…

I have. This was before I realized it was in their cardmember agreement. The woman grabbed my cart and held onto it, preventing me from leaving with my belongings until I conjured a receipt.

Re: The failure of self-checkout technology

#457

Post by camgunz »

radarsat1 wrote: post #251
CM30 wrote: post #248

It feels like almost all the issues with self-checkout technology come from the attempts to minimise shoplifting, which don't even seem that effective at doing that. In theory, a system that let you scan products the same way checkout staff do without any weight checks or bagging area rules or other interruptions would be incredibly efficient. Especially if you could do things like scan the same product multiple time…

That's exactly how it works in the Netherlands, you just scan your items and go. There are no weight checks and you can scan items more than once and edit and remove things from the list. Apart from getting a poorly executed random check sometimes (which is far from effective for the purpose of avoiding theft imho) it actually works really well.

Yeah, but these checks are bonkers. Whenever we get one (maybe 2x a month) the store worker literally takes everything out of our bag and scans it again. It takes forever, and then we have to repack the bag. Don't get me wrong, I vastly prefer it to the scales in the US, but they're terrible and do nothing to prevent stealing (in fairness anecdata, but Jumbo reported they lost millions to stealing and I know multiple people who say they steal from Albert Heijn every time they go).

Re: The failure of self-checkout technology

#458

Post by l3x4ur1n »

misja111 wrote: post #446

I love the self-checkouts, I have been using them since 5 years now and only very rarely do I still checkout out at the cashier. Here in Switzerland I also don't seen any sign of supermarkets backing out of it, quite the contrary. I guess the article is specific for the US or the UK. I don't think the technology is a failure at all, the problem seems more specific to the culture.

Same in Slovakia. I love self-checkouts, been using them preferably. Paired with scanning items to the store app as I pick them from aisle and then just scanning self-checkout QR code so all the items neatly import to checkout register and I just pay for it and go (Kaufland, Tesco). It's been really good experience.

Re: The failure of self-checkout technology

#459

Post by toyg »

jtbayly wrote: post #382
CM30 wrote: post #248

It feels like almost all the issues with self-checkout technology come from the attempts to minimise shoplifting, which don't even seem that effective at doing that. In theory, a system that let you scan products the same way checkout staff do without any weight checks or bagging area rules or other interruptions would be incredibly efficient. Especially if you could do things like scan the same product multiple time…

I disagree. The majority of the problems that I run into with self-checkout are related to not being able to buy items I picked up off the shelf like Mucinex or children's cough syrup or alcohol without getting an employee to check me out... at self checkout. What's the point of "self" checkout if somebody is required —not by failure of the system but by rules—to come help me several times during the process? Edit: a…

This seems easily fixed: just ask the consumer to show a driver license or other accepted ID, with some software validating whether it is legit. It will still be slower than a regular cashier judging your full beard and receding earline, but it would remove most human oversight.

Obviously there is a risk of illegally selling items to minors with fake documents, but I think that's fixable too. Already, in my local UK supermarket there are cameras on each checkout station, which I guess go to some bored reviewer; so you could just alert the guy "hey, customer X gave us a valid license" and assume that he'll react if he can't see a realistic amount of wrinkles.

Re: The failure of self-checkout technology

#460

Post by [deleted] »

david-gpu wrote: post #305
dahfizz wrote: post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Enjoy your homogenous, high trust society. We are all jealous.

> Enjoy your homogenous, high trust society "Homogeneous" in what way? Because in my experience the sort of "homogeneity" that leads to high trust is that of wealth/income, and it requires a generous social net.

[deleted]
Post reply on HN