Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

The failure of self-checkout technology

bbc.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

291–300 of 621 posts

Re: The failure of self-checkout technology

#291

Post by QVVRP4nYz »

workfromspace wrote: post #152

Obviously this sounds like such a US problem. Self checkout in the UK and Europe (Estonia and Barcelona) IME works perfectly: - No thefts - Many people with card payments - Working self checkout machines Also, recently I have been thinking how come the US is pioneering so many tech but fail to implement any, such as: - Payments: No SWIFT/IBAN, still lots of cash usage, no e-invoices (ie for utility bills), still usin…

Ignoring the question if USA is actually behind: there is a very strong technology catch-up effect. Some countries started mobile phones with 3G, and never wasted money on quickly outdated analogue/2G hardware. New banks created in 90s in Eastern Europe also benefited from not having 30 years old legacy mainframe systems running COBOL.

Re: The failure of self-checkout technology

#292

Post by k4rli »

CM30 wrote: post #248

It feels like almost all the issues with self-checkout technology come from the attempts to minimise shoplifting, which don't even seem that effective at doing that. In theory, a system that let you scan products the same way checkout staff do without any weight checks or bagging area rules or other interruptions would be incredibly efficient. Especially if you could do things like scan the same product multiple time…

I just scan the barcodes on my phone and place everything in bag as I go along. Before leaving the store a QR on the POS kiosk display is scanned with the store phone app and I just need to select on POS if I will pay through app (pre-added card info) or physical card/cash. As simple as it gets.

No one checks the products. Occasional random checks happen but the checking frequency probably depends if past checks have found issues, so I get a bag check once a year max.

Re: The failure of self-checkout technology

#293

Post by Pepe1vo »

Freak_NL wrote: post #275
dahfizz wrote: post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Enjoy your homogenous, high trust society. We are all jealous.

Nah, don't worry. Theft at self checkouts is turning into a national hobby¹. 1: https://www.nrc.nl/nieuws/2024/01/05/de-diefstalcijfers-stij...

Every time I read one of these articles the naivety and tone-deafness from supermarkets over these self-checkouts amazes me.

"In order to make more money we made customers self-report their purchases during a cost-of-living crisis while we were booking record high profits and now these customers are _under reporting_ their purchases, how dare they!!"

They should've seen this coming from miles away.

Re: The failure of self-checkout technology

#294

Post by 6510 »

fy20 wrote: post #284
t8sr wrote: post #209

I was surprised how bad these machines were in the UK and the US. It’s possible to implement the idea better. A big source of friction seems to be the (IMO) unreasonable focus on theft prevention, and the second is that stuff in the store isn’t labeled properly. Somehow, the self checkouts in Switzerland are mostly free of both problems. I’m guessing they’re more willing to take the theft risk, to increase throughput…

I think part of the problem is the technology hasn't changed in the last 20 years. During college I worked at a large UK retail store when they had the self checkouts installed, and other than a slightly nicer design, today it is effectively the same as it was then. For example today I still struggle to scan things with the laser barcode scanner, where as cameras are much more reliable for scanning barcodes today. Th…

Right, it should be able to tell what kind of fruit or vegetable is on the scale and [at least] highlight it in the maze of menus. The larger the supermarket the funnier the search. Likewise it could see I have 2 croissants with cheese in stead of having me search though a list of packaged bread half of which isn't even on the shelve. It should be able to see the shelves too. It doesn't need good vision, if it can see there are 5 big piles from afar and people purchase 5 kinds it gets rather obvious which are the most likely candidates. If 3 out of 5 shelves are empty you shouldn't display all the nice things I cant have. It seems a fun project to work on.

Re: The failure of self-checkout technology

#295

Post by valzam »

CM30 wrote: post #248

It feels like almost all the issues with self-checkout technology come from the attempts to minimise shoplifting, which don't even seem that effective at doing that. In theory, a system that let you scan products the same way checkout staff do without any weight checks or bagging area rules or other interruptions would be incredibly efficient. Especially if you could do things like scan the same product multiple time…

I have never understood the point of theft prevention at a self-checkout via the weight checks etc. If I want to steal something I just ... don't scan it? And keep it in my backpack. I don't see how the buggy weight checks serve any purpose other than annoying honest customers.

Re: The failure of self-checkout technology

#296

Post by petergrace »

Tor3 wrote: post #290
alpaca128 wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In theory, a system that let you scan products the same way checkout staff do without any weight checks or bagging area rules or other interruptions would be incredibly efficient How would it be more efficient than a traditional checkout? There's no way the average person can match the speed of a cashier who does that every day, and at least the supermarkets I've visited don't have enough self checkout machines to…

> "There's no way the average person can match the speed of a cashier who does that every day," Absolutely true, and not only that - the cashier has a conveyor belt while the self-checkout counter has a slightly inconvenient and much slower system. But that's totally offset by the fact that there's typically only one or two cashiers while there may be ten or twenty self-service counters. I don't have to stand in line…

But having 1-2 cashiers is only the norm now because of self checkout. Prior to self checkout there used to be nearly all lanes staffed at our local grocery and wait times to checkout were low.

Re: The failure of self-checkout technology

#297

Post by avidphantasm »

If a cashier makes a mistake, I always correct it when I catch it because I know it can count against them. When a self-checkout machine makes the occasional mistake (namely, charging too little for an item) I never correct it because it’s all on the store and who am I to correct them.

Re: The failure of self-checkout technology

#298

Post by bluGill »

matthewdgreen wrote: post #108
devilbunny wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sure that's great, but it's a bit impractical for groceries. Even the relatively small cost of an NFC tag is going to be a real problem given how thin most groceries' margins are (and how cheap small amounts of food can be, even now). But groceries are one of the best examples of where this would be a big time-saver. I will say that I really do prefer self-check in convenience stores, where a big purchase is thre…

When I started looking at RFID tech in 2004, the disposable tags cost maybe $.50-$1 but general consensus was the costs would follow a Moore’s law like trajectory, halving every 2-3 years until they were on even the cheapest items. And yet here we are 20 years later and I don’t see RFID checkout systems very often at all. Are the tags still really expensive? Or is it the extra cost of attaching them to packaging?

things like razors interfere and so they are not accurate enough to use. They probably work great in niches, but they are not a universal answer.

Re: The failure of self-checkout technology

#299

Post by resolutebat »

framapotari wrote: post #273
scott_w wrote: post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interestingly, Marks & Spencer don't have scales for your shopping (unlike all other self-checkouts). I wonder if there's cultural and demographic reasons for this. M&S is a very upmarket supermarket, so a potential thief (typically quite poor) is going to stand out like a sore thumb and end up with a security guard stuck to their waist. The larger supermarket chains (Tesco, Asda, Morrisons) have low-cost lines to ca…

How would you identify a shoplifter at M&S based on their socioeconomic dress code?

Start here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chav

Re: The failure of self-checkout technology

#300

Post by Tor3 »

petergrace wrote: post #296
Tor3 wrote: post #290

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "There's no way the average person can match the speed of a cashier who does that every day," Absolutely true, and not only that - the cashier has a conveyor belt while the self-checkout counter has a slightly inconvenient and much slower system. But that's totally offset by the fact that there's typically only one or two cashiers while there may be ten or twenty self-service counters. I don't have to stand in line…

But having 1-2 cashiers is only the norm now because of self checkout. Prior to self checkout there used to be nearly all lanes staffed at our local grocery and wait times to checkout were low.

Well, not at my local Coop. They have three cashier stations, nowadays one or two of them are manned (and the third person is free to assist customers where needed).

In my other living place, Japan, the MaxValu supermarket has, I think, around ten cashiers - not only that, those cashiers are super fast and use double-buffering for payment: You can pay while they're already busy with the next customer. But still - they have also introduced self-service. They still have nearly the same number of inhumanely fast human cashiers but they now also have lots of self-service desks (and a person there to assist anyone needing it).

Post reply on HN