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Ask HN: Where can I find good legal documents?

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Re: Ask HN: Where can I find good legal documents?

#31

Post by samstave »

jakestein wrote: post #13
smohnot wrote: post #10

For those not familiar: Common Paper https://commonpaper.com/standards/ seems to have the best free standard docs. Here's the post where they describe it https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36043944 here's another one: https://www.avodocs.com/

Thanks for the mention and kind words! I’m one of the cofounders of Common Paper, happy to answer any questions. Our docs are free, released under creative comments, have been downloaded more than 17,000 times and used to close millions of dollars worth of deals. If you’re not sure what kind of contract you need, this blog post might help: https://commonpaper.com/blog/saas-contracts/

Do you know of any similar resources in the Family Law area? (not sure how to specifically word my question, but helping someone with some custody related issues - and wondering if there is some resource I could be aware of to help?)

Else, was going to turn to the GPTs and see what they may muster, but any even general direction pointers would be appreciated?

Re: Ask HN: Where can I find good legal documents?

#34

Post by chadash »

samstave wrote: post #31
jakestein wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for the mention and kind words! I’m one of the cofounders of Common Paper, happy to answer any questions. Our docs are free, released under creative comments, have been downloaded more than 17,000 times and used to close millions of dollars worth of deals. If you’re not sure what kind of contract you need, this blog post might help: https://commonpaper.com/blog/saas-contracts/

Do you know of any similar resources in the Family Law area? (not sure how to specifically word my question, but helping someone with some custody related issues - and wondering if there is some resource I could be aware of to help?) Else, was going to turn to the GPTs and see what they may muster, but any even general direction pointers would be appreciated?

IANAL, but there are some things where you should really get expert advice. Child custody is one of them.

I think with legal docs generally, you have to decide what the stakes are and act accordingly. In general, keep in mind that most lawyers won't take a case unless there's someone with deep pockets to sue. So for that $20k loan you give to a friend, a boilerplate template is fine; if they don't want to pay you back, a lawsuit is gonna cost you more than the loan anyway. You've got a new startup for website monitoring with 20 customers? Worry about growing your userbase, not the remote chance that you get sued and something in the boilerplate docs you used wasn't worded properly (of course, once you raise significant money or have significant revenue, those legal docs become much more important, and also this doesn't apply if you are working on something with significant risk, such as a medical device).

But child custody isn't one of those things. It is high stakes, the chances that your counterparty will sue you are very high, and a bad outcome might be one of the worst things that can happen to you. Personally, the possibility of losing custody of my children would be much more worrying to me than any financial lawsuit.

Re: Ask HN: Where can I find good legal documents?

#35

Post by grepfru_it »

fortran77 wrote: post #30
traceroute66 wrote: post #28

> Where can I find good legal documents? A lawyer. A lawyer. A lawyer. A lawyer. END OF STORY. And I'm saying that from a perspective of someone who used to use free/cheap template docs a long time ago. The hard reality is that free/cheap ready-made docs are highly unlikely to be suitable for your business context for one or more of the following reasons: - Jurisdiction of you or your clients - Insurance requirements…

Exactly. These free legal documents are great—until you have to litigate one.

Extending this thread because it costs maybe max 2 hours of consult time with a lawyer to put one together. $500 today can save you from a $5M lawsuit tomorrow.

And even then you should still read it and become intimately knowledgeable with each provision

Re: Ask HN: Where can I find good legal documents?

#36

Post by smcavinney1 »

smohnot wrote: post #10

For those not familiar: Common Paper https://commonpaper.com/standards/ seems to have the best free standard docs. Here's the post where they describe it https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36043944 here's another one: https://www.avodocs.com/

I've saved so much time using CommonPaper at my company. Many agreements are still negotiated, but even the cover-page concept makes it that much easier to understand what is being argued.

Re: Ask HN: Where can I find good legal documents?

#37

Post by samstave »

chadash wrote: post #34
samstave wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you know of any similar resources in the Family Law area? (not sure how to specifically word my question, but helping someone with some custody related issues - and wondering if there is some resource I could be aware of to help?) Else, was going to turn to the GPTs and see what they may muster, but any even general direction pointers would be appreciated?

IANAL, but there are some things where you should really get expert advice. Child custody is one of them. I think with legal docs generally, you have to decide what the stakes are and act accordingly. In general, keep in mind that most lawyers won't take a case unless there's someone with deep pockets to sue. So for that $20k loan you give to a friend, a boilerplate template is fine; if they don't want to pay you bac…

I was more looking for properly formatting a document for filings was all?

Maybe thats a poor example - but forms help thats not spammy, but also not "starting a business related"

Legal resources online all seem so "Better Call Saul" quality. Like going to a used car lot.

Re: Ask HN: Where can I find good legal documents?

#38

Post by dylan604 »

samstave wrote: post #31
jakestein wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for the mention and kind words! I’m one of the cofounders of Common Paper, happy to answer any questions. Our docs are free, released under creative comments, have been downloaded more than 17,000 times and used to close millions of dollars worth of deals. If you’re not sure what kind of contract you need, this blog post might help: https://commonpaper.com/blog/saas-contracts/

Do you know of any similar resources in the Family Law area? (not sure how to specifically word my question, but helping someone with some custody related issues - and wondering if there is some resource I could be aware of to help?) Else, was going to turn to the GPTs and see what they may muster, but any even general direction pointers would be appreciated?

> was going to turn to the GPTs

this seems ripe for disaster. hopefully, you weren't serious. as with all things, I'd really hope anything in the realm of legal documents from GPT would be then consulted with an actual lawyer

Re: Ask HN: Where can I find good legal documents?

#39

Post by fratimo66 »

I work for iubenda (https://www.iubenda.com/) and it's a precious tool for website compliance. I was a user myself before joining the team.

You can get: Privacy Policy/T&C/Cookie and Consent Banner as well as a Consent Database tool.

The onboarding starts with a scan of your website, and you are suggested to use specific configurations based on the legislation that will apply to your website. Moreover, iubenda scans regularly your website and checks for non-compliance clues (e.g. a missing service in your privacy policy).

Pricing: there's a free plan for you to start with a basic configuration + pay as you grow.

Re: Ask HN: Where can I find good legal documents?

#40

Post by CPLX »

traceroute66 wrote: post #28

> Where can I find good legal documents? A lawyer. A lawyer. A lawyer. A lawyer. END OF STORY. And I'm saying that from a perspective of someone who used to use free/cheap template docs a long time ago. The hard reality is that free/cheap ready-made docs are highly unlikely to be suitable for your business context for one or more of the following reasons: - Jurisdiction of you or your clients - Insurance requirements…

This isn't necessarily true.

I've spent six figures on legal fees easily, and I also use templates and off the shelf stuff all the time. Clerky is a good resource and is fine for most core stuff.

You just can't pay lawyers every time you do everything, it's a waste of resources for small simple businesses that may never go anywhere. And the other issues is EVEN IF YOU DO that doesn't guarantee anything, most lawyers are just using THEIR templates anyways and charging more. If you don't know what to ask for you and don't yet understand the business dynamics you really get almost no value add from having an actual lawyer.

I'm currently paying a law firm about $20k to rewrite a bunch of docs that I used templates for about 5 years ago. I consider that a success, the business now has millions in revenue and can afford it and it's fine. That's a pretty normal sequence of events in business.

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