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Starlink Successfully Tests Space Direct to Cell Mobile Service

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Re: Starlink Successfully Tests Space Direct to Cell Mobile Service

#161

Post by pests »

Reason077 wrote: post #96
modeless wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree that Apple's capability is similar. The feature only allows texting emergency services, requires holding the phone in a specific orientation to send or receive, is separate from your carrier service (only two years are free with purchase), and is exceedingly slow. SpaceX's service will allow texting and receiving texts from anyone using your carrier number, plans to support third party messaging apps such…

… and the SpaceX service works with any ordinary modern phone. Not just the latest iPhone with special hardware.

It's not special hardware. They are just utilizing the underlying capabilities of their the Qualcomm broadband chip. Anyone else using the same chip can add satellite functionality too.

Re: Starlink Successfully Tests Space Direct to Cell Mobile Service

#162

Post by modeless »

Scoundreller wrote: post #154
lxgr wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The 7 Mbit/s are for an entire cell, i.e. all devices simultaneously transmitting in it, not per device. Iridium (a comparable system) used to support about 10 Mbit/s per satellite in its first satellite generation, which had 48 spot beams each. The second generation supports about a megabit per modem, but these have larger antennas than a regular satphone. > Apple doesn't disclose the bitrate of their Emergency SOS…

I hope one day Apple can jam some more features in the downstream. Would be cool to broadcast news or weather updates just by pointing your phone at the sky for a few moments. Satellite should be able to blast the signal. Downsides: no real "cell" infra for Globalstar, and it doesn't work far outside of landmasses.

I don't see a need for this. It's pretty clear SpaceX's approach can scale to real voice and data service. All you need are more satellites and bigger antennas and you'll have something way better than a one way broadcast like satellite radio or something.

SpaceX has launched the current constellation with Falcon 9; Starship will be able to launch much bigger satellites much faster and much cheaper. And it will work over 100% of the Earth's surface (modulo legal issues) with continuous coverage, as Starlink already does. And SpaceX won't be the only ones doing it.

Re: Starlink Successfully Tests Space Direct to Cell Mobile Service

#163

Post by Scoundreller »

miki123211 wrote: post #48

I think the advent of Chat GPT makes this announcement that much more significant. Until recently, always-available, extremely-low-bandwidth, text-only communication was interesting, but not that interesting. You could use it in emergency situations or to talk to friends, depending on how low-bandwidth we're talking about, but that's about it. You couldn't use it for internet browsing or to look up information you mi…

Thanks to cheap storage, one can do quite a lot "offline". Got all of "max" Zim version of en-wikipedia on my phone thanks to kiwix, at 100gb. And offline google maps in the places I might end up (but dumb how it can't do walking/cycling directions).

Re: Starlink Successfully Tests Space Direct to Cell Mobile Service

#164

Post by Scoundreller »

lxgr wrote: post #115
dzhiurgis wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Slight downside, but in many places you can’t text 911 or local equivalent

With Apple's service, you're not actually communicating with a regular 911 service, but rather a specialized service provider that relays your emergency call to local authorities (and more recently car roadside assistance services). Relaying texts to a phone call is very likely part of what they do.

d'oh, the roadside assistance is US only, not even in Canada :(

Re: Starlink Successfully Tests Space Direct to Cell Mobile Service

#165

Post by chpatrick »

carabiner wrote: post #127
berserk1010 wrote: post #11

I wonder if this service will facilitate collapse of censorship in dictatorship countries like China and Russia. Especially if those countries are currently suffering from economic depression like China and Russia, and its citizens are waking up to its harsh realities and are keen to get unfiltered information

China is as free as the US. You can leave the country and emigrate to the US, and that's why there are so many Chinese everywhere. No, it's not Orwellian any more and people do not carry a "little red book" with them. Chinese people can choose their jobs, start a company, pursue hobbies like rock climbing and guitar and gardening and live basically like most westerners.

Except you can't have certain political opinions without going to jail, that's a pretty big difference.

Re: Starlink Successfully Tests Space Direct to Cell Mobile Service

#166

Post by eternityforest »

tjohns wrote: post #142
eternityforest wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

PLBs are not cheap, used ones cost at least $100, 100x more than most people are willing to spend on safety (How many people have no emergency water at home?). I don't understand how anyone could regularly go hiking out of cell range without one though. Some commenters seem to actively like being that disconnected I suppose.

People went hiking for centuries before satellite messengers were a thing. The fact is, calling for help via satellite while in the backcountry is often a 12-24 response time. Sending another person in your party back to civilization to call for help is also a viable option. Anything more time sensitive than that and outside help is unlikely to arrive in time. The most important thing is to travel in a group, and mak…

They did, but people have probably also avoided certain areas if possible, because it's scary to be on your own, since before we even had a concept of hiking or any kind of civilization to want to take a break from.

As I understand it, just plain old getting lost is kind of a big deal, and one of the things I'd be most afraid of if I regularly went out alone or with people who weren't far better at navigating than me(Which is nearly 100% of my friends...).

If you are near any water that probably won't kill you for several days.

Re: Starlink Successfully Tests Space Direct to Cell Mobile Service

#167

Post by cqqxo4zV46cp »

modeless wrote: post #61
bonestamp2 wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I don't know if this has been announced before... When they announced the original deal with T-Mobile, they said that T-Mobile would handle the (spectrum) license for the US and they're looking for a partner in other countries with the appropriate spectrum licensing. US T-Mobile customers would have access to this SpaceX service in any country where there is a partner with the spectrum license. https://www.t-mobile…

I disagree that Apple's capability is similar. The feature only allows texting emergency services, requires holding the phone in a specific orientation to send or receive, is separate from your carrier service (only two years are free with purchase), and is exceedingly slow. SpaceX's service will allow texting and receiving texts from anyone using your carrier number, plans to support third party messaging apps such…

There’s more nuance to the pricing situation that I think is worth mentioning.

Whilst Apple said that they’d charge for this, they IIRC never announced pricing, and offered the first year free. That first year has since lapsed and they’ve committed to keeping it free for another year. Given the negative PR that would come of, say, a death that could’ve been prevented had someone subscribed to Uncle Tim’s Apple Emergency Plus Prime, I have every expectation that Apple will continue to swallow the cost.

Not to say that anything you said was wrong, and not to say that it’s not still a precarious situation. Just offering additional detail to those that haven’t watched this as closely.

Re: Starlink Successfully Tests Space Direct to Cell Mobile Service

#170

Post by jacquesm »

xattt wrote: post #149

Do any of the 4G/5G protocols accommodate satellite-based comms with some sort of special transmit mode from the phone side? It blows my mind that any of this is possible, because I was a futurist as a kid, but completely dismissed off-the-shelf cell-to-sat as sci-fi only.

Well, given that it is pretty much always line-of-sight it has (relatively) low power requirements compared to the distance involved, from you to the satellite you will mostly have to deal with attenuation by water vapor.

Also: satellite can do beam steering through phasing shifting multiple antennas without any moving parts. So once a satellite knows you exist it can further reduce the power requirements by focusing on a phone when sending or receiving from that particular phone.

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