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How to Be More Agentic

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Re: How to Be More Agentic

#151

Post by thecrims0nchin »

pphysch wrote: post #136
Podgajski wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My point is to help you not forget your compassion. All this talk about agency is nothing if you don’t have the luck to go along with it. So if you see someone who’s homeless, don’t talk to them about their agency. Just help them.

> Just help them. Trivializing homelessness like this doesn't help, and I strongly disagree that "agency is nothing" to unhoused people. There are many free resources available, but the organizations providing them often don't have the capacity to efficiently allocate them to those in need, due to difficulties with reach, etc. Escaping poverty is a function of others' generosity (luck) but also agency; you can't do i…

They didn't say 'agency is nothing', you took that out of context. They said 'talk about agency is nothing without luck'

It's like me saying a bowl of soup is useless without a spoon. And you go quote me as, "a bowl of soup is useless".

You are arguing with yourself

Re: How to Be More Agentic

#152

Post by Podgajski »

anthomtb wrote: post #141
Podgajski wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe you could just take a look at her Twitter bio! “Born lucky” https://twitter.com/catehall This aversion to the effect of luck is just making me realize how deluded many people are in the tech industry. And how they fell under the spell of lucky people who are successful, telling you it’s not about luck.

Fair play. I was working off the links and context from this thread and did not think to look at anyone's twitter bio. Anyways, the argument you seem to be making (I may have it wrong) is that you can dismiss Cate's article on agency because she also admits to be lucky. That may explain why successful people, both in and out of tech, are hesitant to acknowledge the role of luck.

I’m not dismissing agency. I think agency is important. I’m just exposing you to the overruling effect of luck. And luck matters more than agency.

Re: How to Be More Agentic

#153

Post by bsdpufferfish »

Podgajski wrote: post #7
gumby wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Luck happens to those who let it. Random opportunity comes along, you happen to be in a position to take advantage of it, and you happen to see it as it arrives.

What’s with all the woo hoo here on HN? The very definition of the word luck goes against your “frame it on the wall” feely good saying. “success or failure apparently brought by chance rather than through one's own actions.” but I guess you’re also saying that people who get cancer are just letting it happen? Maybe they should’ve investigated the edges. You see there are two types of luck, good luck and bad luck. Ho…

> The very definition of the word luck

Maybe you can define it for us.

Re: How to Be More Agentic

#154

Post by throwaway98797 »

SeanAnderson wrote: post #110

This article really spoke to me, but, ironically, I am concerned about my ability to put it into practice. I feel like there are areas of my life I have extreme agency over and others I have no agency over. I hate it because the areas I feel I lack agency in run counter to my sense of self. Things I struggle to do don't feel like things I should struggle to do. I wonder if this is something I learned when I was young…

anything external is possible

anything internal is impossible

ie make money ez

lose weight impossible

got to be some kind of psych issue

Re: How to Be More Agentic

#155

Post by nick__m »

d-lisp wrote: post #145
nick__m wrote: post #20

Assume everything is learnable This made me think of late grandmother who used to say : "c'est faite par du mondes" which roughly expand to "a person did/learned/discovered that so there is no a prioi reason that I cannot do so myself". That's the greatest value she passed unto me. When I feel that I cannot do something, I think about that phrase and persevere.

You probably mean "c'est fait par du monde" or maybe that's some way of mocking french language that I am not aware of !?

it's the way it's spoken where I reside.

Re: How to Be More Agentic

#156

Post by danielmarkbruce »

stvltvs wrote: post #35
danenania wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Something else I find encouraging, and the reason, basically, that "everything is learnable" is that all knowledge, no matter how complex, is composed of fundamentally simple parts. Just as complex tasks or complex movements are composed of many simple steps or movements. This is what makes the maxim that "you don't understand something unless you can explain it in simple terms" true.

Yes, and this has its limits. Many true experts in their fields would struggle to explain their field simply. I like to think I'm an expert in my work, but how many times have I explained to my wife what I do in simple terms, and she still has no idea what I do? Complex ideas often get distorted or lost in simple explanations.

Absolutely. And most things most people work on today are complex. To do my job I need to understand 100 different things. Not a single one is difficult. But to explain it in simple terms simply isn't possible because it's not 1 or 2 big things.

When people explain things in simple terms, they are often either borderline lying, or tucking an exceptionally large tree of concepts under a single word or phrase.

Re: How to Be More Agentic

#157

Post by danielmarkbruce »

adfisgnio1234 wrote: post #140

I think this post does a great job of arguing against its own thesis. This woman was apparently the rank one poker player in the world. She obviously has great natural ability and works hard at what she does. So why doesn't she stick with anything for longer than a few years? Why has she had an impressive start to four or five different careers without following through on any of them to real greatness? She believes,…

There has to be a high correlation between people who get bored and move on and people who can learn things fast (either by technique/personality or raw iq points or both).

Re: How to Be More Agentic

#158

Post by Podgajski »

FredPret wrote: post #147
Podgajski wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m not removing the role of agency from success, as long as luck is on your side.

I wonder what someone like Viktor Frankl would think of all this.

On the average, only those prisoners could keep alive who, after years of trekking from camp to camp, had lost all scruples in their fight for existence; they were prepared to use every means, honest and otherwise, even brutal force, theft, and betrayal of their friends, in order to save themselves. We who have come back, by the aid of many lucky chances or miracles - whatever one may choose to call them - we know: the best of us did not return.

Viktor E. Frankl

He would say he was lucky.

Re: How to Be More Agentic

#159

Post by algas »

vaylian wrote: post #124

> Someone recently asked me how one might go about learning charisma, and the answer was really boring: by reading a few books, watching many hours of charismatic people interacting with others, and adopting a few of their habits. Any recommendations for books?

The classic is How To Win Friends and Influence People by Dale Carnegie -- highly recommended. If you're young and looking for something more helpful in romance, watch Before Sunrise.

Re: How to Be More Agentic

#160

Post by ants_everywhere »

spease wrote: post #127
ants_everywhere wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People used to think few things were learnable and you had to have innate talent to learn something. One of the few remaining holdouts of this idea is perfect pitch. Most people I've seen express an opinion don't believe it's learnable after some childhood cutoff period. I'm not sure how well researched it is, though.

There was a study where they found that taking valproate opened a critical period that helped people learn it. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3848041/

Very cool, I wasn't aware of that study. Thanks!
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