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Cloudflare Termination Video: A Master Class in How Not to Terminate Someone

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Re: Cloudflare Termination Video: A Master Class in How Not to Terminate Someone

#41
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In her own words, and seems like its the way the company works, she had a 3 month ramp - which I presume is along the lines of training, mentoring, pairing, learning the ropes by example etc - and then let lose to get stuck in, which as she says has been only one month that overlaped a holiday period. It sure seems like Cloudflare are just culling staff to me, or her manager has no managerial abilities and doesn't kn…

She was in sales and sold nothing. 3 months is a long time to be unproductive. People complain about corporations sending out emails to notify people they have been fired or laid off. This person posting a hit video is a prime example why companies make things as brief as possible with no interaction available.

She had 3 months of training, only 1 month of actual sales with the december holidays in the middle, what is it exactly that you don't understand ?

Re: Cloudflare Termination Video: A Master Class in How Not to Terminate Someone

#42
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In her own words, and seems like its the way the company works, she had a 3 month ramp - which I presume is along the lines of training, mentoring, pairing, learning the ropes by example etc - and then let lose to get stuck in, which as she says has been only one month that overlaped a holiday period. It sure seems like Cloudflare are just culling staff to me, or her manager has no managerial abilities and doesn't kn…

The problem with judging any of this is the same as knowing your history lessons and sources. All we've really got to go on is Brittney Peaches account and Matthew Princes account and neither are going to be reliable sources. We'll never know if what Brittney Peach said is reliable and we'll never know if what Matthew Prince says is true.

We might never know if it was "justified", but we have everything we need to judge how the termination was delivered though, and that one is a shitty look for Cloudflare.

Re: Cloudflare Termination Video: A Master Class in How Not to Terminate Someone

#43
post #2

[flagged]

I would hire her in a second. She saw something unethical and made it public at risk of personal cost. Hiring her is like sending the message "we aren't afraid of this happening because we don't do that." I would view hiring her as a positive sign for a potential employer.

Not only that, she comes off as authentic and sold her side of the story very well with that video. She speaks clearly and cogently, even while emotions are clearly bubbling. I think that video shows her skills as a salesperson in action.

Good leaders hire people who keep them in check. Poor leaders hire people they can walk over.

She is making them pay a much greater cost than her severance in PR and that benefits me because I am more likely to be in her position than I am to be in the CEO's position.

I straight up won't work for CloudFlare now after seeing this and the CEOs feeble response. CloudFlare is now in the category of "corporate" in my head.

I would rather live in a country made of people like her than a country made of people who don't fight back when they feel wronged.

Corporate America is able to be a steaming pile of garbage because most people think like you and not her, so there are no consequences for HR assholes being HR assholes, and since there are no consequences, the dehumanizing behavior keeps on going. She provided consequences. Now those HR workers are going to have to sit in meetings and develop more empathetic policies or come up with a sales pitch on why that video is wrong themselves. The CEO is probably going to have to talk to shareholders about it.

Next time they might look at the potential set of consequences (or another company might) and say it's not worth it.

The least we owe her is solidarity.

Re: Cloudflare Termination Video: A Master Class in How Not to Terminate Someone

#45
post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

NDAs are for keeping the company's trade secrets in the company. They aren't so you can treat your employees badly and expect that to stay secret.

I understand your point. But reality is different. Most employee NDAs will include a non disparage clause in the agreement. Its standard. This is Why we have glassdoor forums. So you can disparage anonymously. Or maybe she didnt sign the NDA and if so disparage away just dont expect other emoloyers to come running to you.

The reality might be that companies are immoral, but saying "I wouldn't hire this person because they might expose my immoral practices" does make you look bad, rather than the person.

Re: Cloudflare Termination Video: A Master Class in How Not to Terminate Someone

#47
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In her own words, and seems like its the way the company works, she had a 3 month ramp - which I presume is along the lines of training, mentoring, pairing, learning the ropes by example etc - and then let lose to get stuck in, which as she says has been only one month that overlaped a holiday period. It sure seems like Cloudflare are just culling staff to me, or her manager has no managerial abilities and doesn't kn…

She was in sales and sold nothing. 3 months is a long time to be unproductive. People complain about corporations sending out emails to notify people they have been fired or laid off. This person posting a hit video is a prime example why companies make things as brief as possible with no interaction available.

Corp sales isn't like low-margin, high-volume sales where you're expected to always be closing right from jump.

The deal sizes are usually much higher; consequently, you need more people with authority to be in agreement that the purchase is worth it.

To do that, you need to make relationships, navigate corporate hierarchies, get on calendars, etc. All of that takes time.

It is possible that this person wasn't doing any of that, hence the termination. This is very unlikely if this was a bulk termination. Doubly so given that she was hired so close to the holidays.

Re: Cloudflare Termination Video: A Master Class in How Not to Terminate Someone

#48
post #2

[flagged]

> Brittney P. should be worried about her future job prospects. This video is now viral. I would think twice about hiring her.

This video reminds me of the cop who was suspended for continually posting TikTok videos of herself dancing while in uniform even after being warned multiple times to stop[0]. Her reaction was to keep doing it.

Regardless of who is right in this situation (neither side in my mind) this "blew up" and as you say there isn't a manager or org that isn't paying close attention to this. She's going to have serious challenges in getting her next role. Whether fair or not she's radioactive at this point. If nothing else if Britney P is in a two/all party recording consent state this is technically illegal. Not saying that's right but it is the law...

I'd go as far as to say I'd never hire her. Work is challenging enough without knowing a person you're working with could be manipulating/trapping you for their social media account(s) and actually has in the past. Right/wrong is often grey and a matter of perspective. One person's freedom fighter is another person's terrorist.

To the people who are saying you would hire her and view this as admirable - fair enough but situations can be very subtle and you wouldn't feel the same way if she caught you on a bad/off day and setup a situation where you could very easily be portrayed as the "bad guy" and "put you on blast".

It's just not worth the risk.

Explanations for this in my mind:

1) Social media addiction is a real thing. According to the American Society of Addiction Medicine the definition of addiction is "People with addiction use substances or engage in behaviors that become compulsive and often continue despite harmful consequences."

2) Looking for any situation to serve as a springboard for a new "career" as a social media "personality".

3) Doing ANYTHING for fame or attention.

4) The only good explanation - wanting to bring attention to an unjust situation. My cynical and dim view of social media, "influencers", etc makes me think this is the most remote explanation. Even if this is the case situations where only one party knows they're on a stage gives them a massive advantage in these kinds of interactions and if you watch the video it's obvious from the start this was a trap. The Cloudflare employee on the other end of the line is completely incompetent and ironically should be fired for their performance for how they did overall but also for not recognizing this is clearly the case. As the linked article says right up front:

"This is a prime example of why you should always assume your employees are recording your conversations."

Great, what a wonderful environment we've created for ourselves.

It's one thing to record, it's another thing entirely to record and post to social media. If Britney P was solely collecting evidence/documentation she could have recorded the video and kept it to herself but no, straight to TikTok.

Slight tangent - also see the situation where a "prank" social media person was shot during one of their pranks[2]. The whole social media prank thing is completely disgusting to me and the fact a jury acquitted the shooter leads me to believe that taking advantage of ordinary people with these parasitic, dangerous, and obnoxious "pranks" (harassment) is disgusting to most people who aren't desperate social media addicts.

The social media person's response to this situation was unbelievable, with them saying "We’re gonna continue the videos. It is what it is". I believe they're also on record saying how great the entire thing was because it only lead to more attention and views... See 1-3 - you very well could have died and you might next time yet you lean in harder. Yeah, I'd say that meets the definition of addiction. It's no different than OD'ing on fentanyl and continuing to use.

What people will do for the clicks/followers/likes is incredible.

[0] - https://www.clickorlando.com/news/investigators/2021/05/31/o...

[1] - https://www.asam.org/quality-care/definition-of-addiction

[2] - https://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/jury-divided-over-w...

Re: Cloudflare Termination Video: A Master Class in How Not to Terminate Someone

#49
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In her own words, and seems like its the way the company works, she had a 3 month ramp - which I presume is along the lines of training, mentoring, pairing, learning the ropes by example etc - and then let lose to get stuck in, which as she says has been only one month that overlaped a holiday period. It sure seems like Cloudflare are just culling staff to me, or her manager has no managerial abilities and doesn't kn…

The problem with judging any of this is the same as knowing your history lessons and sources. All we've really got to go on is Brittney Peaches account and Matthew Princes account and neither are going to be reliable sources. We'll never know if what Brittney Peach said is reliable and we'll never know if what Matthew Prince says is true.

Why is Brittney’s video not a reliable impartial account? Also note that nothing she says about her performance and feedback is in any way disputed during the call. They had nothing to say to the contrary.

Re: Cloudflare Termination Video: A Master Class in How Not to Terminate Someone

#50
post #2

[flagged]

I would hire her in a second. She saw something unethical and made it public at risk of personal cost. Hiring her is like sending the message "we aren't afraid of this happening because we don't do that." I would view hiring her as a positive sign for a potential employer. Not only that, she comes off as authentic and sold her side of the story very well with that video. She speaks clearly and cogently, even while em…

> Not only that, she comes off as authentic and sold her side of the story very well with that video.

I'm definitely not defending Cloudflare on this but that's much easier to do when you're the only party knowing the interaction is going to TikTok.

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