Majority of debtors to US hospitals now people with health insurance • Hacker News Board

Re: Majority of debtors to US hospitals now people with health insurance

#81

Post by paxys » Thu, Jan 11, 2024, 10:38 PM UTC

alwa wrote: post #39

Buried midway down, they mention that the commercial health plans available to people without conventional employers (Obamacare) can (and routinely do) set deductibles as high as $9,450. And that’s in addition to the premium-which, in New York City for example, starts at $618/month for the very worst plan for an individual. Sure, that’s subsidized for lower-income households — but who among those has a spare $10K lyi…

Obamacare was essentially gutted when the individual mandate was deemed unconstitutional and removed. If young, healthy people aren't signing up and paying into the system then of course the sick ones will bear the brunt of it. That's just how insurance works.

Re: Majority of debtors to US hospitals now people with health insurance

#82

Post by beaeglebeached » Thu, Jan 11, 2024, 10:40 PM UTC

AlecSchueler wrote: post #71

beaeglebeached wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Server is better analogy. The wage you pay/owe the waiter is direct and (mostly) separate from meal, albeit informal with only shame as a deterrent for default.

I'm not based in the US, so my servers are paid a wage directly by the restaurant.

That makes sense, but the ah ah ah this isn't the US card comes unexpected on an analogy developed specifically alongside a US based topic.

Re: Majority of debtors to US hospitals now people with health insurance

#83

Post by NoMoreNicksLeft » Thu, Jan 11, 2024, 10:40 PM UTC

Buttons840 wrote: post #77

ahi wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been getting those separate bills recently and it's driving me nuts. For one small out patient procedure I have received bills from the hospital, the doctor, the anesthesiologist, anesthesiologist nursing company, and a random surgeon I have never met that the doctor asked in for a 30 second consult (I know how long the procedure took) while I was under. Seriously considering ignoring some of these whotf-are-you…

I'm surprised medical billing scams aren't rampant, considering it's 100% normal to have a bill from from an unknown company show up asking for payment for unclear reasons for a procedure done a year ago.

> I'm surprised medical billing scams aren't rampant, considering it's 100% normal to

The difference between honest-to-god scams, and just these meaningless me-too bills that accompany every medical procedure or test... well, is there a difference?

If a scam is some scheme or trick to get you to pay for something you never agreed to pay for and wouldn't agree to pay for if it were said up front, through deception strategies like opaque policies and maneuvering you to a point where you can no longer back out of it...

Then pretty much all of it is a scam. That the people performing the scams have professional degrees in medicine, that they're gainfully employed as hospital and medical company employees, and so on, that doesn't really change the nature of it.

Originally, the "scammy" behavior was developed (and not deliberately) to try to coerce the insurance companies into paying. But the insurance companies could afford employees to counter all those tactics. This didn't mean the experise was wasted though, they simply turned that onto the patients themselves.

The crazy thing to remember is that none of that expertise will go away, no matter what happens. Maybe they'll turn it on the government too, at some point, if we ever get universal healthcare. That could be a hoot, couldn't it?

Re: Majority of debtors to US hospitals now people with health insurance

#84

Post by wolverine876 » Thu, Jan 11, 2024, 10:43 PM UTC

Don't let yourself get caught up in these details. The problem is the unreformed healthcare system; these are just more symptoms of it. It's like the old, failing server at work - people say the problem is the power supply, the outdated driver, etc. - it's not; the problem is we haven't installed a new server.

We all can see the US healthcare system is awful. If you aren't doing anything about it, the problem is you. The politicians against healthcare reform are well-known; if you can't persuade people to vote them out, you're not trying (following the example of political leaders who don't try). (And spare me the helplessness routine - that's for losers - generations of Americans and other democracies have managed to get things done.)

EDIT: People need to stop debating whether they are powerless, and the 999 ways they are powerless, the hopelessness of powerlessness - and start posting solutions.

Another thought: It's another institution or market being funded by the wealthy (donations) for the wealthy (those who can afford it).

Re: Majority of debtors to US hospitals now people with health insurance

#85

Post by paxys » Thu, Jan 11, 2024, 10:44 PM UTC

beaeglebeached wrote: post #8

Hospital said I owed debt. Contested claim with debt collectors. Never saw it again and not on my credit report. Know a few people who've done this.

Every single debt should be contested. "Oh but I know I owe this". How do you know you owe it to that specific collector? Can you be sure it wasn't sold twice? Can you be sure the company didn't already write it off? Can you be sure that paying it means it'll actually be marked paid in their system?

The entire debt collection industry is a mess, and only the absolute worst players operate in it. If you try and stay honest and moral you will be taken for a ride.

Re: Majority of debtors to US hospitals now people with health insurance

#86

Post by kuczmama » Thu, Jan 11, 2024, 10:45 PM UTC

wolverine876 wrote: post #84

Don't let yourself get caught up in these details. The problem is the unreformed healthcare system; these are just more symptoms of it. It's like the old, failing server at work - people say the problem is the power supply, the outdated driver, etc. - it's not; the problem is we haven't installed a new server. We all can see the US healthcare system is awful. If you aren't doing anything about it, the problem is you.…

> The politicians against healthcare reform are well-known

Who are they specifically?

Re: Majority of debtors to US hospitals now people with health insurance

#87

Post by paxys » Thu, Jan 11, 2024, 10:47 PM UTC

wolverine876 wrote: post #84

Don't let yourself get caught up in these details. The problem is the unreformed healthcare system; these are just more symptoms of it. It's like the old, failing server at work - people say the problem is the power supply, the outdated driver, etc. - it's not; the problem is we haven't installed a new server. We all can see the US healthcare system is awful. If you aren't doing anything about it, the problem is you.…

One can blame politicians and corporations all they like, but the simple fact is that >50% of the country (and significantly more than that when accounting for skewed political representation) does not want the system to change, because to them any alternative is "socialism".

Re: Majority of debtors to US hospitals now people with health insurance

#88

Post by verisimi » Thu, Jan 11, 2024, 10:48 PM UTC

kuczmama wrote: post #86

wolverine876 wrote: post #84

Don't let yourself get caught up in these details. The problem is the unreformed healthcare system; these are just more symptoms of it. It's like the old, failing server at work - people say the problem is the power supply, the outdated driver, etc. - it's not; the problem is we haven't installed a new server. We all can see the US healthcare system is awful. If you aren't doing anything about it, the problem is you.…

> The politicians against healthcare reform are well-known Who are they specifically?

Just vote them out. The medical system is the only issue that matters. /s

Re: Majority of debtors to US hospitals now people with health insurance

#89

Post by massysett » Thu, Jan 11, 2024, 10:49 PM UTC

The headline doesn’t say much and the text doesn’t say much more. It could be that such debtors are the majority solely because the number of uninsured has dropped.

For instance, if in 2000 there were 2000 debtors with 100 of them being insured, and in 2020 there are 200 debtors with 150 of them being insured, this headline would be true. Which would be ok if the story shed light on this, but it doesn’t.

Re: Majority of debtors to US hospitals now people with health insurance

#90

Post by antisthenes » Thu, Jan 11, 2024, 10:50 PM UTC

wolverine876 wrote: post #84

Don't let yourself get caught up in these details. The problem is the unreformed healthcare system; these are just more symptoms of it. It's like the old, failing server at work - people say the problem is the power supply, the outdated driver, etc. - it's not; the problem is we haven't installed a new server. We all can see the US healthcare system is awful. If you aren't doing anything about it, the problem is you.…

The absolutely best (and most impactful) thing you can do as an individual is to _not pay the damn debt_ to the hospital.

The illusion of impact by writing to your congressman is really just that, a proverbial carrot in front of the donkey of democracy.