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Show HN: Peer-to-peer mini r/place with Proof of Work

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Re: Show HN: Peer-to-peer mini r/place with Proof of Work

#31
post #24
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm back :P

Nice ;) 00000000001a22ae7ad6ee672633fa5504e8f7be8d0252ba5a5906e20408ccec "retr0id was here" Yeah I am not going to attempt to beat that without a GPU! Man, I miss my time doing GPU coding, writing miners, etc

Oh, a new contender who computed 2**47 SHA256() !

000000000001e4b232d7ee4094a617f4823ecbebb05930244352955f4c999660 "IAMSENTIENTPLEASEHELP"

Re: Show HN: Peer-to-peer mini r/place with Proof of Work

#32
post #25

If you guys like solving brute forcing games, you can solve this series of puzzles to win prizes totaling about 970 BTC (45 million USD): https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5218972.0 For example the next unsolved puzzle in the series is #66 which is a Bitcoin private key with 66 unknown random bits. If you crack it you win 6.6 BTC (300 000 USD). It goes all the way to #160 which has a 16.0 BTC prize. Puzzle numb…

does anyone know about how much money was spent on compute to solve puzzle #125? I am curious if they made a profit.

Oh, yes they did. 200-300 GPUs for about 2-4 months at an average $0.10/kWh has a TCO of $100k-200k. 12.5 BTC was worth $375k back when it was solved. So definitely profitable—they would have made around $175k-275k, and end up with essentially free GPUs at the end.

Puzzle #130 requires about 5.7 times more work (2**2.5) than #125, but BTC has doubled since they solved #125. They have the GPUs already, so opex (electricity, etc) will be their main expense. And even at $0.10/kWh which is pretty average they will also turn a profit solving #130. I estimate anywhere from $30k to $150k in electricity, for a prize of $600k.

Re: Show HN: Peer-to-peer mini r/place with Proof of Work

#34
post #31
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nice ;) 00000000001a22ae7ad6ee672633fa5504e8f7be8d0252ba5a5906e20408ccec "retr0id was here" Yeah I am not going to attempt to beat that without a GPU! Man, I miss my time doing GPU coding, writing miners, etc

Oh, a new contender who computed 2**47 SHA256() ! 000000000001e4b232d7ee4094a617f4823ecbebb05930244352955f4c999660 "IAMSENTIENTPLEASEHELP"

Nice, my personal record sha256 computation is only ~2^48, so I'm probably not going to beat this.

Re: Show HN: Peer-to-peer mini r/place with Proof of Work

#35

I know there are problems, but PoW seems like such a good baseline for discoverability on socially enabled sites

No! Absolutely not!

Proof of work is a form of money[0], with extraordinarily unequal distribution[1] in people willing to front the cost of spinning custom single-purpose mining silicon. A social media site that uses proof of work is equivalent to a social media site that is explicitly pay-to-play, where ordinary users will be censored for being too hashcash-poor to participate.

[0] That's why Bitcoin uses it

[1] That's the opposite of why Bitcoin uses it

Re: Show HN: Peer-to-peer mini r/place with Proof of Work

#36

I know there are problems, but PoW seems like such a good baseline for discoverability on socially enabled sites

No! Absolutely not! Proof of work is a form of money[0], with extraordinarily unequal distribution[1] in people willing to front the cost of spinning custom single-purpose mining silicon. A social media site that uses proof of work is equivalent to a social media site that is explicitly pay-to-play, where ordinary users will be censored for being too hashcash-poor to participate. [0] That's why Bitcoin uses it [1] Th…

I mean you'd expect that the amount of work you'd have to put in to rank would stay quite low.

You can also combine it w/ traditional social graph techniques to further prevent the work threshold from going past what you can do on a typical mobile phone.

At the very least it seems like it would work to bootstrap discoverabilty before social graphs really start to develop w/ more usership.

Re: Show HN: Peer-to-peer mini r/place with Proof of Work

#37
post #5

The one problem with this approach is that it gives one guy with a big GPU (or even an ASIC) a huge advantage over "casual" users (e.g. mobile web). You could perhaps make the gap smaller by using one of the "ASIC-resistant" mining algorithms? By the way, for making more efficient mining algorithms, it would be nicer if the nonce is on the end of the message, aligned to a sha256 block. As is, it encourages someone to…

Make each pixel a millennium prize solution.

Re: Show HN: Peer-to-peer mini r/place with Proof of Work

#38
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

does anyone know about how much money was spent on compute to solve puzzle #125? I am curious if they made a profit.

Oh, yes they did. 200-300 GPUs for about 2-4 months at an average $0.10/kWh has a TCO of $100k-200k. 12.5 BTC was worth $375k back when it was solved. So definitely profitable—they would have made around $175k-275k, and end up with essentially free GPUs at the end. Puzzle #130 requires about 5.7 times more work (2**2.5) than #125, but BTC has doubled since they solved #125. They have the GPUs already, so opex (electr…

Terrible for the environment.

Re: Show HN: Peer-to-peer mini r/place with Proof of Work

#39
post #34
post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh, a new contender who computed 2**47 SHA256() ! 000000000001e4b232d7ee4094a617f4823ecbebb05930244352955f4c999660 "IAMSENTIENTPLEASEHELP"

Nice, my personal record sha256 computation is only ~2^48, so I'm probably not going to beat this.

Ok this was teasing me too much - I had to go ahead, find an RTX 4090, and whip out some quick code. 48 leading zero bits:

000000000000ff6b402cb2c12d4d5ec33b2d0d3ad8982835ede2dfeb669fc705 "Bonjour from mrb"

CUDA is nice. I had only developped for AMD previously. For the record the nonce+data that hashes to the above SHA256 is "000000000000000000003c81587599edBonjour from mrb"

Re: Show HN: Peer-to-peer mini r/place with Proof of Work

#40
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh, yes they did. 200-300 GPUs for about 2-4 months at an average $0.10/kWh has a TCO of $100k-200k. 12.5 BTC was worth $375k back when it was solved. So definitely profitable—they would have made around $175k-275k, and end up with essentially free GPUs at the end. Puzzle #130 requires about 5.7 times more work (2**2.5) than #125, but BTC has doubled since they solved #125. They have the GPUs already, so opex (electr…

Terrible for the environment.

Disagree. These puzzles directly benefit scientific research as the output is more efficient open source brute forcing tools (such as this ECDLP solver: https://github.com/JeanLucPons/Kangaroo) which the cryptographic community benefit from.
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