Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

British Post Office Scandal

en.wikipedia.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

41–50 of 153 posts

Re: British Post Office Scandal

#41

Post by IshKebab »

ndsipa_pomu wrote: post #16
sdflhasjd wrote: post #3

Is there any actual technical report of what's wrong with the Horizon system? This feels like a weirdly long Wikipedia article that only touches on legal points and that somewhat lacks in real substance.

There's some more detail here: https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2024/jan/09/how-the-post... It only mentions a few bugs out of the hundreds that were discovered (a full list hasn't been published), but it appears that the bugs weren't the only issue: > In 2015, for instance, the Post Office told the House of Commons inquiry: “There is no functionality in Horizon for either a branch, Post Office or Fujitsu to edit,…

Have they really "finally started to investigate". They opened an investigation in 2020, apparently interviewed 2 people and then gave up. What have they done recently?

Re: British Post Office Scandal

#42

Post by countrymile »

mjburgess wrote: post #19

In middle of this it's obscene how the media neglects to mention who did most of the actual investigative journalism: https://www.private-eye.co.uk/ -- for years on end, whilst the issue was ignored by the rest of the press. They all now jump in on it and elide the years of work put in by the PE. This is a common tactic in media outlets, esp. here, for the major sources to try to "own" issues with nearly zero work pu…

this sums up the government response (it's a parody, a very good parody...): https://twitter.com/RosieisaHolt/status/1744711394405044569

Re: British Post Office Scandal

#43

Post by maratc »

mjburgess wrote: post #30

To clarify how this happened: in the UK anyone can bring a private prosecution where they effectively act as the prosecutor . This is usually used by charities who take on laws to prosecute (eg., crimes against animals). Here the post office used the law to prosecute its own staff in alleged crimes against the post office . So they were both the prosecutor and the victim. This gave them overwhelming incentives not to…

> So they were both the prosecutor and the victim.

Not UK, but this is (usually, I think) the case with private prosecution. When the public prosecution decides not to prosecute, the options for the victim are either do nothing, or go the private prosecution way. In the latter case, the victim will be the prosecutor too.

Re: British Post Office Scandal

#44

Post by drcongo »

mjburgess wrote: post #19

In middle of this it's obscene how the media neglects to mention who did most of the actual investigative journalism: https://www.private-eye.co.uk/ -- for years on end, whilst the issue was ignored by the rest of the press. They all now jump in on it and elide the years of work put in by the PE. This is a common tactic in media outlets, esp. here, for the major sources to try to "own" issues with nearly zero work pu…

Private Eye deserve huge credit for their doggedness - they kept at it despite it not getting picked up by any major newspaper beyond a two paragraph mention buried deep inside. Let's not write Nick Wallis out of this though, his Radio 4 series was instrumental in bringing it wider attention.

Re: British Post Office Scandal

#45

Post by arethuza »

xarope wrote: post #33
pmx wrote: post #2

My wife was watching the ITV drama on this last night and I had to leave the room. It was making me so incredibly angry that such huge injustices can be allowed to take place. I recommend the show to anyone with better control of their emotions that me!

Is this Mr Bates vs the Post Office? Worth watching? I am just finishing up the latest season of The Crown, and was looking for some other british docudrama to watch (sometimes it's nice to watch a show without a mandated sex scene, car chase, etc)

Yes, I would recommend it and I had previously read the "The Great Post Office Scandal" book (which I would also recommend).

Edit: My wife who is a pretty hard nosed commercial litigation lawyer was thoroughly shocked by it - so much so that she actually went off and read the court judgements to get more details.

Re: British Post Office Scandal

#46

Post by ndsipa_pomu »

IshKebab wrote: post #41
ndsipa_pomu wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's some more detail here: https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2024/jan/09/how-the-post... It only mentions a few bugs out of the hundreds that were discovered (a full list hasn't been published), but it appears that the bugs weren't the only issue: > In 2015, for instance, the Post Office told the House of Commons inquiry: “There is no functionality in Horizon for either a branch, Post Office or Fujitsu to edit,…

Have they really "finally started to investigate". They opened an investigation in 2020, apparently interviewed 2 people and then gave up. What have they done recently?

Apparently so, but they're not forthcoming with more details as it's an active investigation now since the TV series is drawing attention to the scandal.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-67899189

Re: British Post Office Scandal

#47

Post by VBprogrammer »

walthamstow wrote: post #9
hashtag-til wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly curious: can you expand a bit on why subscribe? I live in the UK, but never heard about Private Eye before?

The most obvious and current reason is their tireless work on the Post Office scandal, but in general they print news that newspapers won't for fear of losing their relationships with politicians and other powerful figures. A recent example is the story that an MP walked in on Carrie blowing Boris in his office as Foreign Secretary while he was still married to another woman, and that at the time he was also trying t…

I couldn't immediately find the reference but if I remember correctly they also referenced Boris' alleged fair with a Russian Violinist (potentially the one which sparked the "get off my f*cling laptop" incident), at least in cartoon form. Allegedly there is a super injunction on that one.

Re: British Post Office Scandal

#48

Post by drcongo »

MarcusE1W wrote: post #14
smcl wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was just reading the other day that some MP was calling for those who were affected to have their names cleared. It's fucking astounding that this hasn't been a priority until the recent TV series on it has come out.

This skandal is 6 years old. I find it hugely concerning that someone has to make a TV play that resonates with the public for politicians or anyone responsible really to show any interest in resolving this. The current activities and proposals probably have to be seen as crowd management and might not be an honest attempt for a solution, again.

It's 25 years old!

Re: British Post Office Scandal

#50

Post by abigail95 »

HatchedLake721 wrote: post #26

BBC explains why it’s hard to overturn the convictions: The scale of the Post Office scandal means that there are no easy and quick solutions for the government. Ministers could advise the King to grant Royal Pardons, once reserved for the condemned as they faced the gallows. But these would be largely symbolic acts because the government can't, at the stroke of a pen, quash a conviction. That’s because the courts ar…

Why does an appeal require government support?

There's no way reasonable doubt remains, what is the legal barrier that an appeal court is trying to deal with?

> But these would be largely symbolic acts because the government can't, at the stroke of a pen, quash a conviction

This is untrue. Judges may not like it but I don't really care. The parliament is legally soverign and the courts are subservient to interpret and apply the laws as written in the legislation. If they write a law that says these convictions mean nothing, then they mean nothing.

Common law constitutionalism is based on the fact that individual rights exist - not the right of a judiciary to have separate powers.

Post reply on HN