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United finds loose bolts on plug doors during 737 Max 9 inspections

theaircurrent.com

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Re: United finds loose bolts on plug doors during 737 Max 9 inspections

#351

How were these not noticed in proper inspections? Is this the first time these planes have been inspected?

> Is this the first time these planes have been inspected?

Most likely weren't checked since the planes left the factory yes.

To quote from: https://theaircurrent.com/feed/dispatches/united-finds-loose...

"The five aircraft were delivered to United between November 2022 and September 2023, according to ch-aviation, and would likely not have been through a heavy maintenance C check that occurs every 4,000 to 6,000 hours or two to three years."

Re: United finds loose bolts on plug doors during 737 Max 9 inspections

#352

Earlier quoted context omitted.

7s and 10s aren’t out in the wild yet. Only 8s and 9s.

Correct, but I've seen a lot of confusion that its a systemic problem (ala MCAS) with the Max family. It doesn't look that way. It looks like a manufacturing problem on one particular variant.

The 8 had the great MCAS crashes (boeing solution ? tell the pilot to turn it off when it happens !), the 7 has anti icing that burnout the engine nacelle and make it fall (boeing solution ? being exempted from the certification requirement of your engines not falling off and we will fix it in a few years !), the 9 has doors that fall off (boeing doesn't even have a solution on that one, but they know others bolts are at risk too since they warned to check the rudder bolts on jan 5), ... At this point it's a systemic problem with the MAX overall. The only one without issue is the 10 and it's because it's not out yet, but Boeing want a fast track on certification for it because obviously they're doing so good with these there is no need to fully check it.

And frankly this time we're talking about the worst of the worst, the basic first step of making airplanes : being able to ensure parts of it doesn't fall off for no reason. This is not a design issue, not a cost cutting "they didn't put enough sensors" reason, this is straight up "their manufacturing is bad and their QA is not able to catch it", ... These things have barely started flying and 5 of those are already affected (well, 6 ...), this is absurd.

Sure MBA taking over tends to kill engineering companies ability to make great product, but even Hewlett Packard is still able to make printers that print (they suck, but that's by choice from them)...

Re: United finds loose bolts on plug doors during 737 Max 9 inspections

#354

Literally just flew on a United Airlines 737 MAX 9 one week ago. It seems like the craft I flew on has probably been grounded in the week since. I noticed that we were flying on a MAX before boarding and nearly asked to switch flights, but consoled myself that I was being irrational and that the planes were almost certainly fine now. Guess my confidence was misplaced.

I mean, you're here now. Plane did its job.

The safety margins on flying machines is really high, so while Boeing really should figure out what the hell is going on, the plane didn't fall out of the sky after a depressurization incident. It failed to a known state (ideally by design!)

Re: United finds loose bolts on plug doors during 737 Max 9 inspections

#355

How were these not noticed in proper inspections? Is this the first time these planes have been inspected?

> Is this the first time these planes have been inspected? Most likely weren't checked since the planes left the factory yes. To quote from: https://theaircurrent.com/feed/dispatches/united-finds-loose... "The five aircraft were delivered to United between November 2022 and September 2023, according to ch-aviation, and would likely not have been through a heavy maintenance C check that occurs every 4,000 to 6,000 hou…

I think parent meant inspected by the factory before sending it to the airline, not the regular maintenance check from the airline.

Re: United finds loose bolts on plug doors during 737 Max 9 inspections

#356
post #41

I found it interesting that Boeing did proactively tell airlines to inspect 737 MAXs for a possible loose bolt in a different part of the plane (rudder section) at least 8 days before the January 5th event. Example story: https://www.reuters.com/business/aerospace-defense/boeing-ur... Unfortunately, Boeing did not know they had other issues with the plug door bolts.

Imagine the quality of the manufacturing and QA / final inspection to have that kind of issue.

Re: United finds loose bolts on plug doors during 737 Max 9 inspections

#357

How were these not noticed in proper inspections? Is this the first time these planes have been inspected?

> Is this the first time these planes have been inspected? Most likely weren't checked since the planes left the factory yes. To quote from: https://theaircurrent.com/feed/dispatches/united-finds-loose... "The five aircraft were delivered to United between November 2022 and September 2023, according to ch-aviation, and would likely not have been through a heavy maintenance C check that occurs every 4,000 to 6,000 hou…

I read that too, but it says they have 79 of this aircraft. Were all of them new? Or did only the new ones have this issue?

Re: United finds loose bolts on plug doors during 737 Max 9 inspections

#358
Assuming that it's up to airline's employees (not Boeing) to remove/replace the panel/'plug as needed - and that 'loose bolts' means 'not properly torqued' rather than 'can't be', the logical conclusion is that the problem lies with the airline's employees (not Boeing).

IOW, it's far too early to be speculating about blame.

Re: United finds loose bolts on plug doors during 737 Max 9 inspections

#359

Doesn’t this call into question the manufacturing of ALL 737 MAX’s including the 7 and 8 since they must use the same manufacturing process?

Only the max-9 has the door plug, the smaller airframes don't have that door, and the larger airframes always have the door fitted

Boeing already warned airlines on january 5 (before the door issue) to check for lose bolts in a different section of the plane (the rudder). This is not a door plug issue.

Re: United finds loose bolts on plug doors during 737 Max 9 inspections

#360

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Half the A320neo fleet needs to be grounded for 250-300 days over the next year due to engine manufacturing issues affecting their wear (which tbf is entirely Pratt & Whitney's fault). Airbus settled a $2bn suit last year with Qatar Airways over A350 paint jobs so bad they grounded them and refused to take scheduled deliveries. You'll hear more about Boeing than the rest of the industry put together because this is H…

So Airbus has fault for a paint job? While they should do better, that sounds a lot safer than airplanes losing pieces or crashing down to me. > You'll hear more about Boeing than the rest of the industry put together because this is HN... That's not it.

> That's not it.

I mean, it is. The Pratt & Whitney engine issue which is going to ground half the MAX's rival's aircraft for a year because a manufacturing fault makes the engine turbine blades liable to crack garnered two threads and zero comments (Boeing got more for a fun story about paper planes!). Airbus being found at fault but acquitted of involuntary manslaughter by a Paris court last year for the AF447 crash (a 2009 mid air stall with a few MCAS parallels) passed without comment. HN is not a place for aviation news

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