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FAA orders grounding of more than 170 Boeing 737 Max 9s

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Re: FAA orders grounding of more than 170 Boeing 737 Max 9s

#91

Post by belter »

Ways in which you can experience an unexpected cabin decompression to the next world...Or join the mile-high never-come-back club, on a Boeing 737 MAX...

1- Loose bolts: "Boeing Urges Airlines to Check for Loose Bolt in newer 737 MAX Aircraft" - https://www.european-views.com/2023/12/boeing-urges-airlines...

2- Leave the anti-icing system on for more than 5 min after non-icing conditions: "Boeing still hasn't fixed this problem on Max jets, so it's asking for an exemption to safety rules" - https://www.expressnews.com/business/article/boeing-still-ha...

3- Sit too close to a door not in use: "Alaska Airlines grounds 737 Max 9 planes after section blows out mid-air" - https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-67899564

4 - Possible unscheduled decompression, from incorrectly drilled fastener holes in the aft pressure bulkhead, if being in the wrong plane, at the wrong time: "Boeing and a key supplier find a new manufacturing issue that affects the 737 Max airliner" - https://apnews.com/article/spirit-aerosystems-boeing-737-fus...

I think I am going to need a shared Google Sheet...

Re: FAA orders grounding of more than 170 Boeing 737 Max 9s

#92

Post by dpkirchner »

vlovich123 wrote: post #47
avidphantasm wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At the very least we should have a corporate death penalty. Force the company into bankruptcy, de-list it from the stock market, and turn it into a worker-owned co-op that can never be publicly traded or be sold to private equity.

Even if we had it politicians would rush to protect Boeing. It’s too critical a partner for many large national defense projects.

If it's important enough to national defense, let's nationalize it. Or at least move the parts we absolutely need to the DoD.

Re: FAA orders grounding of more than 170 Boeing 737 Max 9s

#94

Post by jes5199 »

throw0101d wrote: post #64
wkat4242 wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I watched a documentary on Netflix recently that alleged that a lot of this change came from importing McDonnell Douglas management into Boeing after the acquisition. I wonder if the book concurs on that, I don't have time to read it right now. If this is the case I wonder if it could be reversible.

Yes: the running joke is/was that McD bought Boeing with Boeing's money. * https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2019/11/how-boeing... * https://archive.is/q5pQV * https://qz.com/1776080/how-the-mcdonnell-douglas-boeing-merg... * https://simpleflying.com/mcdonnel-douglas-boeing-merger/ B was pressured to buy McD for 'national security' reasons. What would have been a better idea would have been, instead of doing…

I’ve heard variations on this story a few times, successful company swallows failing company and gets infected by failing-culture. Isn’t that what happened to Netscape?

Re: FAA orders grounding of more than 170 Boeing 737 Max 9s

#96

Post by tiahura »

travisgriggs wrote: post #75

At what point does Boeing just scrap the 9s? Completely, for good? It’s all starting to feel like the galaxy note, where you pass a tipping point of no return with public perception.

Because some guy at the factory forgot to lock the door? Isn't that a little melodramatic?

Re: FAA orders grounding of more than 170 Boeing 737 Max 9s

#97

Post by rootusrootus »

One troubling aspect of this is that it appears Alaska had reason to believe something was wrong with this plane but basically ignored it. They were getting pressurization warnings on prior flights, but the only action they took was restricting the plane from flying ETOPS routes.

They're the dominant carrier in my area, so these sorts of screwups make me nervous. I can't easily avoid using them without a fair amount of inconvenience.

Re: FAA orders grounding of more than 170 Boeing 737 Max 9s

#98

Post by panarky »

rootusrootus wrote: post #57
vlovich123 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah especially given the public trust the FAA needs to rebuild after it came out how Boeing got the 737 certified in the first place. It’s an unmitigated shit show top to bottom.

> 737 You mean 737MAX. The 737 and 737NG have been around for decades (almost 60 years for the 737, almost 30 for the 737NG). IIRC the 737NG has a reasonable case for being the safest airliner ever built. There are some designs that have no fatalities, but they also have very low production numbers to go with it.

> safest airliner ever built ... very low production numbers

If one model has 5 million flight hours and zero crashes, and another model has 500 million flight hours and 50 crashes, is it possible to say which model is safer?

Re: FAA orders grounding of more than 170 Boeing 737 Max 9s

#99

Post by yokem55 »

Is there any detail anywhere on what exactly is being inspected? Just the bits of airframe around the where the panel that failed? Can a broader issue with how the airframes were manufactured be ruled out at this point?

The cynical part of me wonders if this isn't just a bit of PR to 'ground' the planes for 'inspections' without actually addressing some kind of root cause.

Re: FAA orders grounding of more than 170 Boeing 737 Max 9s

#100

Post by akira2501 »

throw0101d wrote: post #64
wkat4242 wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I watched a documentary on Netflix recently that alleged that a lot of this change came from importing McDonnell Douglas management into Boeing after the acquisition. I wonder if the book concurs on that, I don't have time to read it right now. If this is the case I wonder if it could be reversible.

Yes: the running joke is/was that McD bought Boeing with Boeing's money. * https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2019/11/how-boeing... * https://archive.is/q5pQV * https://qz.com/1776080/how-the-mcdonnell-douglas-boeing-merg... * https://simpleflying.com/mcdonnel-douglas-boeing-merger/ B was pressured to buy McD for 'national security' reasons. What would have been a better idea would have been, instead of doing…

> B was pressured to buy McD for 'national security' reasons.

Creating monopolies and reducing suppliers actually harms "national security." Our braindead managerial class in action.

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