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Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

businessinsider.com

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Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#631

Post by some_random »

jtc331 wrote: post #579
rappatic wrote: post #60

The article talks about range concerns as if they're simply incorrect or ill-founded: > Niedermeyer said that while an electric car can meet most people's driving needs, it struggles with edge cases like road trips because of the need to recharge. Since Americans have been promised a one-to-one substitute for their gas cars, this seems like a failure; an EV should be able to do everything a gas car can. This idea per…

Yes. It's amazing how many people commenting here effectively refuse to acknowledge that there are ways (and more than one!) in which ICE cars are better than EVs and want to believe that no one could rationally decide on different trade-offs. I own and EV, and I love it. But pretending the paradigm shift comes with no undesirable trade-offs is absurd. And wanting everyone to come to a uniform decision about what the…

It's so much easier to try to shame and gaslight people into believing their problems are fake than it is to fix those problems. The "range anxiety" idea is going to be particularly important as EV tech matures and midmarket vehicles have to start being made, because those vehicles are going to absolutely suck. Right now almost all of the ones we talk about are luxury cars, of course they they fantastic performance and features, but the 20k new car of the future is going to look like the electric Mini Cooper. Estimated range of a bit over 100 miles with a 7 second 0-60. Basically an ICE car but with dramatically worse range.

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#632

Post by dgellow »

wishpishh wrote: post #459
lukas099 wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People focus too much on edge cases when making life decisions, imo. > We need a dining room for when we have parties (has a party once every 2 years; room sits empty 99% of the time) > We need a guest bedroom (guests could stay at the hotel down the street) > I need a pickup truck (driver is an accountant who maybe picks up a couple bags of mulch from Lowes twice a year) I'm glad I live in a prosperous society where…

The sense of self-entitlement in this thread makes me depressed. Intelligent, educated adults react like children when you tell them they can't have all the toys. > But I like living in this kind of excess! Sure, and I'm sure you deserve it. As do we all. But guess what? In the hard cold reality that we live in, it's not sustainable or feasible for everyone to own a huge hulking gas guzzling vehicle just to enable yo…

> If stopping and waiting at a charging station those three times a year you make an 8 hour trip is what it takes to ensure a healthy life for future (and even current) generations, then I'm saving my concern for more pressing matters.

The meaningful changes we would need to ensure a healthy future are way, way harder than getting used to electric vehicles. The fact we cannot even do such a straightforward transition is beyond ridiculous.

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#633

Post by megaman821 »

proc0 wrote: post #236
rdtsc wrote: post #66

> But an analysis from CarGurus found that EV prices were still 28% higher than gas-vehicle prices on average. To me that is bonkers. When EVs were becoming popular, I was expecting to see super cheap, under $10k vehicles. That was the promise: forget about all the IC complicated gears, alternators, transmission, fuel pumps and imagine getting a motor and batteries, what could be simpler!". But no, we ended up with m…

Part of that is making electricity cheaper, which means finding better alternatives to renewables, for the time being. Realistically only nuclear can get there until more breakthroughs happen in solar. Instead we're seeing electricity go up and this is only going to make people double down on gas cars, moving to a different state if needed.

To make electricity cheaper, we need more of nuclear, the most expensive electricity generator?

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#634

Post by brandonagr2 »

wakeupcall wrote: post #404
rappatic wrote: post #60

The article talks about range concerns as if they're simply incorrect or ill-founded: > Niedermeyer said that while an electric car can meet most people's driving needs, it struggles with edge cases like road trips because of the need to recharge. Since Americans have been promised a one-to-one substitute for their gas cars, this seems like a failure; an EV should be able to do everything a gas car can. This idea per…

Range is an issue for me. I commute by public transport or bike. I only use the car for relatively long weekend trips (3/4 hours, 300+km). For these trips, stopping halfway for charging makes no sense: I don't want to add another 30m to the trip. At the destination there is generally no charging infrastructure. If there was, that would be the only point I would consider for charging. Charging infrastructure is still…

Where are you going that your destination doesn't have electricity?

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#636

Post by matsemann »

ecmascript wrote: post #623
talldatethrow wrote: post #90

I think EVs give me LESS range anxiety overall. In my gas car days, atleast once a month I was late for work or an event AND low on gas. Having to remember and think about getting gas was constantly on my mind because I have a pretty long commute. With an electric car, I start every day, always, with a full tank. No matter how late I'm running, I know there won't be a surprise that I need gas in addition to being lat…

Yesterday close to where I live there was a big queue that still isn't resolved in a winter storm (over 1000 cars got stuck). With a gas car, you can physically go and get gas and fill it up manually but an EV would run out of battery, die and would need to be towed. Maybe you live in a place where winter storms are not a reality but where I live the range isn't the problem it's the weather combined with the range. E…

Eh, this event in Skåne is atypical. I live close by a mountain pass in Norway during winter, where people often have to camp for the night to get across, and even there it literally never happened that people would hike for gas. It's such a freak event that no one here cares about that in their choice of car.

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#637

Post by echelon »

jtc331 wrote: post #579
rappatic wrote: post #60

The article talks about range concerns as if they're simply incorrect or ill-founded: > Niedermeyer said that while an electric car can meet most people's driving needs, it struggles with edge cases like road trips because of the need to recharge. Since Americans have been promised a one-to-one substitute for their gas cars, this seems like a failure; an EV should be able to do everything a gas car can. This idea per…

Yes. It's amazing how many people commenting here effectively refuse to acknowledge that there are ways (and more than one!) in which ICE cars are better than EVs and want to believe that no one could rationally decide on different trade-offs. I own and EV, and I love it. But pretending the paradigm shift comes with no undesirable trade-offs is absurd. And wanting everyone to come to a uniform decision about what the…

I live in a condo. We have four charging ports and about a dozen EV owners.

Unless I'm hyper-focused on something, I'm lazy. On the off chance I get lucky and get a charging port, I'm not going to remember to go out in two hours or whatever to move it for someone else to use. I'd probably be getting angry emails for sitting in the charging port for days at a time.

Moreover, I frequently catch myself near empty on the tank. I like that I can find a gas station anywhere and fix the situation almost immediately. I had to sit and wait on a friend's charging once, and it's not something I look forward to.

The whole usage pattern around EVs frankly scares me.

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#638

Post by paulsutter »

Flagged for misleading clickbait. The article says that the growth rate has slowed, yet the title says sales are declining.

> Sure, sales of EVs keep going up — a record 300,000 cars sold in the US in the third quarter of 2023 were electric — but the pace of adoption has markedly slowed

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#639

Post by stetrain »

bdcravens wrote: post #316
rdtsc wrote: post #66

> But an analysis from CarGurus found that EV prices were still 28% higher than gas-vehicle prices on average. To me that is bonkers. When EVs were becoming popular, I was expecting to see super cheap, under $10k vehicles. That was the promise: forget about all the IC complicated gears, alternators, transmission, fuel pumps and imagine getting a motor and batteries, what could be simpler!". But no, we ended up with m…

Unfortunately EVs are still seen as a bells and whistles car, and carmakers are selling to that market.

I think it’s more that the EV battery adds $10k to the cost of the car. So they add lots of cheap bells and whistles (ie touchscreens) to justify that additional price.

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#640

Post by sandos »

darkstar_16 wrote: post #447

I think this is a US only problem. People in the US probably take longer road trips than the rest of the world. When I take a Roadtrip, I need a 20 minute break every two hours anyway, and as far as I have seen that is enough for a charge for the next two hours. It's not perfect but I don't think it's as bad as the people in this thread are making it out be. I'm in Europe btw.

Agree, the american perspective is hard to understand for me as a european.

On the other hand, people with extreme needs, I think, more often write online. It is normal even in my european country seeing a bunch of comments just not agreeing with what a majority if people think.

I have very modest car needs at all, and I seldom write that almost any EV would satisy my range needs. For me its an economic problem instead, just not worth it when driving seldom.

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