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Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

businessinsider.com

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Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#391

Post by epolanski »

protocolture wrote: post #83
rappatic wrote: post #60

The article talks about range concerns as if they're simply incorrect or ill-founded: > Niedermeyer said that while an electric car can meet most people's driving needs, it struggles with edge cases like road trips because of the need to recharge. Since Americans have been promised a one-to-one substitute for their gas cars, this seems like a failure; an EV should be able to do everything a gas car can. This idea per…

Yep. I have a Diesel. My average trip length will be roughly 60km. However, 4 - 8 times a year I need to go much further. Last year a single round trip for work was roughly 2200 km. And that was through extreme rural environments. The vast majority of places I stopped to refill the vehicle did not have electric service. Average trips being serviceable doesnt help me. I dont buy a vehicle assuming it will work on aver…

You can rent a car for these cases.

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#392

Post by didntcheck »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #110
jandrewrogers wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is even worse for people like me, despite having a charger in my home. I almost never drive short distances, I walk everywhere locally. When I do drive, it is very long distances, and in those cases range and refill time counts for a lot. On their best days EVs have inferior range and in many conditions they have markedly inferior range. Add on top of that the lengthy recharge time (topping off a gas tank is idea…

> We will know EVs have arrived when Americans in the mountain west start trading their Subarus for Teslas. No need to get the laggards onboard, you simply need to get to the inflection point where the petroleum supply chain is no longer sustainable (due to demand falling through minimum economic viable throughput). Still at least 10-15 years out, as the US accounts for ~35% global oil consumption. US EV uptake is st…

So the argument for EVs here is not that they're better, but that the experience of owning a gas car will eventually get worse, bringing the convenience bar down to meet EVs? That's hardly compelling. It also reminds me of some people's efforts to "improve" public transport which seem to consist only of intentionally inconveniencing car drivers, but doing barely anything to actually improve the alternatives

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#393

Post by oblio »

niemandhier wrote: post #390
rappatic wrote: post #60

The article talks about range concerns as if they're simply incorrect or ill-founded: > Niedermeyer said that while an electric car can meet most people's driving needs, it struggles with edge cases like road trips because of the need to recharge. Since Americans have been promised a one-to-one substitute for their gas cars, this seems like a failure; an EV should be able to do everything a gas car can. This idea per…

My Skoda Enyaq has a range of around 350 km ( 100% -> 20% ), using a 300kv charger the car is fully charged pretty fast. I have traversed Germany in the north south axis quite comfortably. The thing can pull a trailer, max distance is less but I only need to go the local hardware store. I think those concerns overall are unfounded for most of us.

> My Skoda Enyaq has a range of around 350 km ( 100% -> 20% )

I'm actually curious about this. Say I where to drive with the AC on, 130kmph, outside temperature of -5C. What would you say the range is under these circumstances? Still 350km?

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#394

Post by oblio »

jnsaff2 wrote: post #280
screye wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree. The sustainable alternative to EVs is hybrids, not gas guzzlers. Hybrids can be smaller, cheaper, lighter and gentler on the grid. Each of these matter. Heavier cars cause significantly higher road wear [1], particulate pollution [2] and occupy more space. EVs by necessity, are heavier. This is especially evident in America's favorite product categories : SUVs and Trucks. The Ford- F150 lightning is 1.5x…

Damage to roads goes up with the FOURTH power of axle weight. ALL passenger cars create insignificant road wear compared to heavy trucks. https://x.com/ajisuzu1/status/1681123111364620294?s=46

I can't see that thread, I don't have a Twitter account.

Also, aren't heavy trucks much fewer than regular cars plus don't they have designated routes?

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#396

Post by mooreds »

rappatic wrote: post #60

The article talks about range concerns as if they're simply incorrect or ill-founded: > Niedermeyer said that while an electric car can meet most people's driving needs, it struggles with edge cases like road trips because of the need to recharge. Since Americans have been promised a one-to-one substitute for their gas cars, this seems like a failure; an EV should be able to do everything a gas car can. This idea per…

> 93% of trips are less than 30 miles, but the vast majority of drivers take occasional trips that are beyond the range of an electric car.

We've been happy with two cars. Our main around town car is the electric car, with limited but sufficient range. The second car is ICE and is used for road trips.

It's a good mix for us, but I do expect as the charging system is built out, the second car will eventually be replaced with an electric car. After all, the ICE has 100ish years of infrastructure build out that is going to need to be rebuilt for the transition.

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#397

Post by oblio »

JacobThreeThree wrote: post #302
jillesvangurp wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Correct. Tesla just closed another record quarter. And BYD just surpassed them as the largest EV producer in the world. Both of those things are true because the overall market keeps on growing very rapidly. Which means Tesla can break it's own records and yet not be the largest anymore because another company is growing even faster. We're in a major economic down turn because of things like global pandemics and othe…

>Tesla, BYD, and others don't have these issues because they built their EV manufacturing from scratch and have been optimizing how that works for the last ten years. The fact that Tesla and BYD don't have large, entrenched, auto unions to deal with is the biggest factor in keeping costs low.

Sure, if you don't care about your fellow man, everything can be cheap. That's how we got Nike, H&M, C&A, etc.

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#398

Post by elif »

wolverine876 wrote: post #278
elif wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

After taking an EV on a ~6500 mile road trip a couple months ago, I never want to road trip in a gas car ever again. Highlights: - by the 2.5-3.5 hour mark between charges, I'm ready for a 25-35 min break and its somewhere nice and not a gas station - stop anywhere and sleep with air conditioning for free - never have to use gas station bathroom - never have to calculate any routes or fuel stops - also no gas cars dr…

How are these easier in EVs than in ICE cars? > - by the 2.5-3.5 hour mark between charges, I'm ready for a 25-35 min break and its somewhere nice and not a gas station What does that have to do with the power source? You can take breaks anywhere in an ICE vehicle too. > - never have to use gas station bathroom Can't you use the same bathrooms in ICE vehicles? Are they EV only? Does your EV include a half-bath? > - n…

> You can take breaks anywhere in an ICE vehicle too.

Yea, ADDITIONAL breaks, you also have to take short breaks at gas stations

>Can't you use the same bathrooms in ICE vehicles? Are they EV only? Does your EV include a half-bath?

I am not a lawyer but I do feel comfortable walking into a Marriott bathroom when I am a paying customer for their charging station, but would feel sketchy walking into hotels randomly.

> I just find one when I need it.

You're proving my point here by saying your just find one when you have to. My car just takes me to the ideal one automatically.

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#400

Post by palmfacehn »

mvdtnz wrote: post #161
lukas099 wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People focus too much on edge cases when making life decisions, imo. > We need a dining room for when we have parties (has a party once every 2 years; room sits empty 99% of the time) > We need a guest bedroom (guests could stay at the hotel down the street) > I need a pickup truck (driver is an accountant who maybe picks up a couple bags of mulch from Lowes twice a year) I'm glad I live in a prosperous society where…

The edge cases are the important cases though. Those parties I throw are the highlight of my year. My parents staying here with me is important to me, I wouldn't have it any other way. Yeah I have a desk job but that landscaping work I do in my weekend is one of my favourite hobbies. I refuse to live my life as if these things aren't important to me. I refuse to average my entire life style down to my median day. My…

Put it another way divorced from the politicized issues. Airbags are for an edge case. Backup parachutes are for an edge case. Having a "rainy day fund", rather than going all-in on more profitable long term investments is for edge cases.
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