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Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

businessinsider.com

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Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#71

Post by readthenotes1 »

lesuorac wrote: post #24
TacticalCoder wrote: post #10

> If there's any direct inspiration for the United States' EV policy, it's Norway. As the story goes, Norway introduced some compelling subsidies for EVs Ah yup... Norway, sitting on gigantic oil reserves. Reserves so huge they could decide to just give the finger to the EU and not join. So huge there's a fund benefiting, AFAIK, all Norway citizens. I'm not criticizing Norway. But citing Norway as some kind of EV pos…

> Ah yup... Norway, sitting on gigantic oil reserves. If only the US had oil. I can't imagine what we could do if we produced 5x the oil that Norway does.

Still be 12x in arrears?

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#72

Post by pxeboot »

rappatic wrote: post #60

The article talks about range concerns as if they're simply incorrect or ill-founded: > Niedermeyer said that while an electric car can meet most people's driving needs, it struggles with edge cases like road trips because of the need to recharge. Since Americans have been promised a one-to-one substitute for their gas cars, this seems like a failure; an EV should be able to do everything a gas car can. This idea per…

My next car will be an EV. I have no concern about the advertised range. The real worry is what the range will look like in 5-10 years when it is cold out.

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#73

Post by dghlsakjg »

rdtsc wrote: post #66

> But an analysis from CarGurus found that EV prices were still 28% higher than gas-vehicle prices on average. To me that is bonkers. When EVs were becoming popular, I was expecting to see super cheap, under $10k vehicles. That was the promise: forget about all the IC complicated gears, alternators, transmission, fuel pumps and imagine getting a motor and batteries, what could be simpler!". But no, we ended up with m…

This is a developed markets problem. China is making reasonable (range, amenities, style) electric cars in the $15k range.

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#74

Post by gttalbot »

Hmm...dealerships who make most of their money on service don't like to sell EVs, maybe? Surprise? Have had a Mach E for going on 3Y with 20K miles on it and it's literally needed cabin air filters and windshield washer fluid in that time. No there aren't any buyers being steered away from EVs by dealerships, noticing this...

Oh, and the oil companies selling gasoline have nothing at all to do with the "OMG such DOOM IF EVERYONE PLUGS IN THEIR EV" articles, eh? Let me translate that for you: "OMG such DOOM IF EVERYONE SWITCHES TO AN ENERGY SOURCE FOR DRIVING THAT'S REGULATED". When I charge at home in one of the most expensive states for electricity in the US, I'm still paying half the per-mile electric cost as the Subaru we also have. Oops. Thermodynamics are real, eh?

And let's not mention that it costs a lot of money to buy an ICE car that has anything like the acceleration and torque of a typical EV. I've had relatives (usually of the Fox News watching variety) grump about my car. You know what, it has just enough "mid-life-crisis" fun factor for me -- and that's why I got the damn thing. Because EVs are FUN TO DRIVE, PEOPLE.

So nya nya nya to all you trying to seem reasonable in the HN comments...

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#75

Post by iknowstuff »

TacticalCoder wrote: post #10

> If there's any direct inspiration for the United States' EV policy, it's Norway. As the story goes, Norway introduced some compelling subsidies for EVs Ah yup... Norway, sitting on gigantic oil reserves. Reserves so huge they could decide to just give the finger to the EU and not join. So huge there's a fund benefiting, AFAIK, all Norway citizens. I'm not criticizing Norway. But citing Norway as some kind of EV pos…

lmao

Norway is deservedly the "poster child "because 90% of their sales are BEV, buddy.

And it's not a ludicrous amount of money that can only be funded by oil sales that is being spent on EVs. It's a drop in the bucket compared to US expenditure on auto infrastructure.

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#76

Post by johannes1234321 »

grecy wrote: post #41
TacticalCoder wrote: post #10

> If there's any direct inspiration for the United States' EV policy, it's Norway. As the story goes, Norway introduced some compelling subsidies for EVs Ah yup... Norway, sitting on gigantic oil reserves. Reserves so huge they could decide to just give the finger to the EU and not join. So huge there's a fund benefiting, AFAIK, all Norway citizens. I'm not criticizing Norway. But citing Norway as some kind of EV pos…

> Norway, sitting on gigantic oil reserves The US is currently producing more oil than any country at any time in history. [1]. Also the US has much, much larger reserves than Norway [2] Norway has 0.31% of the world's oil, the US has 2.1% So I'm not sure why Norway's oil has anything to do with this discussion. [1] https://www.cnn.com/2023/12/19/business/us-production-oil-re... [2] https://www.worldometers.info/oil/…

Mind that Norway is a lot smaller, only 5.5M inhabitants, thus per capita the oil revenue is a lot higher. Also in Norway less of the money is going to few private corporations, but to the state, which invests large parts into profitable pension funds, which gives Norway stellar financials and the ability to invest and subsidize into whatever future endeavors they see, like transition to EVs, as they see that oil supplies will tighten up.

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#77

Post by gttalbot »

iknowstuff wrote: post #68
rappatic wrote: post #60

The article talks about range concerns as if they're simply incorrect or ill-founded: > Niedermeyer said that while an electric car can meet most people's driving needs, it struggles with edge cases like road trips because of the need to recharge. Since Americans have been promised a one-to-one substitute for their gas cars, this seems like a failure; an EV should be able to do everything a gas car can. This idea per…

The bigger strawman is that range is the biggest consideration. ~300 miles is plenty when charging takes 15min. Especially given that most charging happens at home, saving time vs going to a gas station every week.

This.

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#78

Post by lukas099 »

rappatic wrote: post #60

The article talks about range concerns as if they're simply incorrect or ill-founded: > Niedermeyer said that while an electric car can meet most people's driving needs, it struggles with edge cases like road trips because of the need to recharge. Since Americans have been promised a one-to-one substitute for their gas cars, this seems like a failure; an EV should be able to do everything a gas car can. This idea per…

People focus too much on edge cases when making life decisions, imo.

> We need a dining room for when we have parties

   (has a party once every 2 years; room sits empty 99% of the time)
> We need a guest bedroom

   (guests could stay at the hotel down the street)
> I need a pickup truck

   (driver is an accountant who maybe picks up a couple bags of mulch from Lowes twice a year)
I'm glad I live in a prosperous society where this is possible and all, but it's kind of annoying.

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#79

Post by reverius42 »

throwitaway222 wrote: post #65
rappatic wrote: post #60

The article talks about range concerns as if they're simply incorrect or ill-founded: > Niedermeyer said that while an electric car can meet most people's driving needs, it struggles with edge cases like road trips because of the need to recharge. Since Americans have been promised a one-to-one substitute for their gas cars, this seems like a failure; an EV should be able to do everything a gas car can. This idea per…

This. I'm not sure why plugin hybrids are not a thing.... actually, I don't even want a plugin "hybrid" I want an EV that never uses the ICE unless you run out of power, then it's just an ICE vehicle entirely... In other words I want something they will never build.

That’s exactly what a plug in hybrid is, and lots of manufacturers make them today. Check out any Toyota model with “Prime” in the name.

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#80

Post by eichin »

femto wrote: post #47

Why don't electric cars use replaceable battery modules with a standard form factor? Advantages would include: 1) It allows the battery to be easily replaced as the car gets older. 2) With a suitable generic form factor, it would allow batteries to be upgraded as technology changes. 3) It would allow people to only populate enough battery slots for their daily needs. Communing to work: you only need to insert a few b…

10 years ago: "Better Place" burned through about $1B trying exactly that.

Today: "Nio Power" has gotten a lot further, with more cars and a chain of robo-garages to do the swap in a couple of minutes.

(Still a single unified module, but it's not clear anyone needs to manage several-hundred-pound modules just yet, maybe when it scales a bit more...)

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