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How Japan Airlines crew led 367 passengers to safety from a burning plane

reuters.com

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Re: How Japan Airlines crew led 367 passengers to safety from a burning plane

#11

Post by steveBK123 »

pletnes wrote: post #4
Freak_NL wrote: post #3

I am inclined to think that this exact same scenario featuring a plane full of not Japanese, but, say, Dutch, English, or Americans, would not have resulted in a full evacuation in 18 minutes; possibly with casualties. Obeying commands as a group in a high-pressure situation? That takes a lifetime of living in a culture where this is normal. A group of military passengers (any nationality) would probably have worked…

Counterexample https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/US_Airways_Flight_1549?wprov=s... Edit: interestingly, the evacuation took about the same time in total, but in a river, not on land.

Arguably looking out the window and realizing they were in the Hudson River might have lead them to realize they weren't going to be swimming with their wheelie.

Re: How Japan Airlines crew led 367 passengers to safety from a burning plane

#12

Post by peter422 »

steveBK123 wrote: post #11
pletnes wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Counterexample https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/US_Airways_Flight_1549?wprov=s... Edit: interestingly, the evacuation took about the same time in total, but in a river, not on land.

Arguably looking out the window and realizing they were in the Hudson River might have lead them to realize they weren't going to be swimming with their wheelie.

The U.S. is a very punitive society and I think if you were to find yourself in the tarmac after an evacuation holding onto your carry on, you’d at minimum be getting a large fine for disobeying a flight attendant and possibly more. Not being in the Hudson isn’t going to change the fact that you are ending up in the middle of nowhere once you are off the plane.

Re: How Japan Airlines crew led 367 passengers to safety from a burning plane

#13

Post by laweijfmvo »

Freak_NL wrote: post #3

I am inclined to think that this exact same scenario featuring a plane full of not Japanese, but, say, Dutch, English, or Americans, would not have resulted in a full evacuation in 18 minutes; possibly with casualties. Obeying commands as a group in a high-pressure situation? That takes a lifetime of living in a culture where this is normal. A group of military passengers (any nationality) would probably have worked…

Maybe this is a good time for me to vent about exit row seating? I was recently on a holiday flight where an older couple walked very delicately up to the gate. When prompted, "are you able and willing to assist in the event of an emergency?" the lady immediately said "oh no, we can't..." and the guy says "well, there won't be an emergency, right?" To her credit, the crew member checking us in very sternly told him that his attitude was completely unacceptable and that their seats would be moved.

But it made me think: realistically, the only people sitting in exit rows should be reasonably fit 18-45 year olds in most cases (and I'd prefer men). Yet it's usually whoever has the most money/points/status to get the extra leg room.

/end rant

Re: How Japan Airlines crew led 367 passengers to safety from a burning plane

#14

Post by ImAnAmateur »

quasse wrote: post #5
Freak_NL wrote: post #3

I am inclined to think that this exact same scenario featuring a plane full of not Japanese, but, say, Dutch, English, or Americans, would not have resulted in a full evacuation in 18 minutes; possibly with casualties. Obeying commands as a group in a high-pressure situation? That takes a lifetime of living in a culture where this is normal. A group of military passengers (any nationality) would probably have worked…

Aeroflot Flight 1492 is a perfect example of this. Passengers were actively working to get carry-on bags down the emergency slide as 41 people were burning to death in the back of the plane.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aeroflot_Flight_1492

https://www.flightglobal.com/analysis/analysis-superjet-fire...

Made for interesting reading. I think that it's possible that one more life could have been saved without those carry-on bags. That's a responsibility the passangers and crew both share.

Re: How Japan Airlines crew led 367 passengers to safety from a burning plane

#15

Post by lbwtaylor »

pletnes wrote: post #4
Freak_NL wrote: post #3

I am inclined to think that this exact same scenario featuring a plane full of not Japanese, but, say, Dutch, English, or Americans, would not have resulted in a full evacuation in 18 minutes; possibly with casualties. Obeying commands as a group in a high-pressure situation? That takes a lifetime of living in a culture where this is normal. A group of military passengers (any nationality) would probably have worked…

Counterexample https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/US_Airways_Flight_1549?wprov=s... Edit: interestingly, the evacuation took about the same time in total, but in a river, not on land.

With roughly half the number of passengers.

Re: How Japan Airlines crew led 367 passengers to safety from a burning plane

#16

Post by [deleted] »

peter422 wrote: post #12
steveBK123 wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Arguably looking out the window and realizing they were in the Hudson River might have lead them to realize they weren't going to be swimming with their wheelie.

The U.S. is a very punitive society and I think if you were to find yourself in the tarmac after an evacuation holding onto your carry on, you’d at minimum be getting a large fine for disobeying a flight attendant and possibly more. Not being in the Hudson isn’t going to change the fact that you are ending up in the middle of nowhere once you are off the plane.

[deleted]

Re: How Japan Airlines crew led 367 passengers to safety from a burning plane

#17

Post by [deleted] »

Freak_NL wrote: post #3

I am inclined to think that this exact same scenario featuring a plane full of not Japanese, but, say, Dutch, English, or Americans, would not have resulted in a full evacuation in 18 minutes; possibly with casualties. Obeying commands as a group in a high-pressure situation? That takes a lifetime of living in a culture where this is normal. A group of military passengers (any nationality) would probably have worked…

[deleted]

Re: How Japan Airlines crew led 367 passengers to safety from a burning plane

#18

Post by oliv__ »

Freak_NL wrote: post #3

I am inclined to think that this exact same scenario featuring a plane full of not Japanese, but, say, Dutch, English, or Americans, would not have resulted in a full evacuation in 18 minutes; possibly with casualties. Obeying commands as a group in a high-pressure situation? That takes a lifetime of living in a culture where this is normal. A group of military passengers (any nationality) would probably have worked…

18 minutes seems like a hell of a long time to get out of a damn burning plane

I've never been to Japan but in the US people are standing and ready to exit as soon as the plane docks to the airport so I can imagine people running for their lives in this scenario.

5 minutes at most would seem more understandable

Re: How Japan Airlines crew led 367 passengers to safety from a burning plane

#19

Post by steveBK123 »

peter422 wrote: post #12
steveBK123 wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Arguably looking out the window and realizing they were in the Hudson River might have lead them to realize they weren't going to be swimming with their wheelie.

The U.S. is a very punitive society and I think if you were to find yourself in the tarmac after an evacuation holding onto your carry on, you’d at minimum be getting a large fine for disobeying a flight attendant and possibly more. Not being in the Hudson isn’t going to change the fact that you are ending up in the middle of nowhere once you are off the plane.

There have been many instances of people deplaning from an engine-on-fire plane in US, with luggage. Spirit, Southwest, and some Caribbean airlines in recent 2-3 years at the very least.

Re: How Japan Airlines crew led 367 passengers to safety from a burning plane

#20

Post by [deleted] »

laweijfmvo wrote: post #13
Freak_NL wrote: post #3

I am inclined to think that this exact same scenario featuring a plane full of not Japanese, but, say, Dutch, English, or Americans, would not have resulted in a full evacuation in 18 minutes; possibly with casualties. Obeying commands as a group in a high-pressure situation? That takes a lifetime of living in a culture where this is normal. A group of military passengers (any nationality) would probably have worked…

Maybe this is a good time for me to vent about exit row seating? I was recently on a holiday flight where an older couple walked very delicately up to the gate. When prompted, "are you able and willing to assist in the event of an emergency?" the lady immediately said "oh no, we can't..." and the guy says "well, there won't be an emergency, right?" To her credit, the crew member checking us in very sternly told him t…

[deleted]
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