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NY Times copyright suit wants OpenAI to delete all GPT instances

arstechnica.com

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Re: NY Times copyright suit wants OpenAI to delete all GPT instances

#291

Post by seydor »

munchinator wrote: post #180

It's interesting to me the ambiguous attitude people have to reproducing news content. Whenever there is a story from NYT on HN (or any other large media outlet), the top comment is almost always a link to an archived version which reproduces the text verbatim. And this seems to be tolerated as the norm. And yet, whenever there is a submission about a book, a TV show, a movie, a video game, an album, a comic book, or…

it s also audacious how these news companies reproduce stories from social media and other electronic media of facts that are, like, freely available in nature. Or how they get embargos and exclusivity to government information as if they are some kind of information-bouncer

Re: NY Times copyright suit wants OpenAI to delete all GPT instances

#292

Post by lotsofpulp »

fodkodrasz wrote: post #284
Yizahi wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good comment, it was very funny to see how people desperately try to find moral justification for pirating media A but not B. "It's apples to oranges, you see, there are less letters in the NYT article than in the book and they are rendered differently, so it is ok to pirate their work. I did nothing wrong!" :)

It is actually pirating content by companies for humongous profit, or pirating by individual human beings for free access to culture and entertainment, oftentimes for content one has already paid for, but rendered inaccessible by megacorporations.

Which content making businesses earn humorous profit margins?

Are all the journalist layoffs a fever dream?

This is one of the more profitable ones, and only because they employ unscrupulous tactics:

https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/NWS/news/profit-ma...

This is NYT, the most successful news business:

https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/NYT/new-york-times...

As for movies/tv show/music makers, let’s just say most people in the software engineering business would look at their numbers and count their lucky stars that they are not in the movie/tv show/music business.

(It is also true that excessive copyright lengths have removed access to content that the public should have a right to).

Re: NY Times copyright suit wants OpenAI to delete all GPT instances

#293

Post by pawelmurias »

Germont wrote: post #241
munchinator wrote: post #180

It's interesting to me the ambiguous attitude people have to reproducing news content. Whenever there is a story from NYT on HN (or any other large media outlet), the top comment is almost always a link to an archived version which reproduces the text verbatim. And this seems to be tolerated as the norm. And yet, whenever there is a submission about a book, a TV show, a movie, a video game, an album, a comic book, or…

To me, there is a sense that the news, which is real information about the society that we currently live in, should be availabe to all participants of that society. The notion of being a good citizen requires that one stays informed. Books, movies, videogames etc. don't have that role and are more consumption goods.

> which is real information

People post archive links even to fake NY Times.

Re: NY Times copyright suit wants OpenAI to delete all GPT instances

#294

Post by bongripper »

afavour wrote: post #246
Germont wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To me, there is a sense that the news, which is real information about the society that we currently live in, should be availabe to all participants of that society. The notion of being a good citizen requires that one stays informed. Books, movies, videogames etc. don't have that role and are more consumption goods.

It’s a difficult problem with no great answers. If you want news to be free at the point of delivery you want public service news agencies. But that means they’re owned by the government… who are frequently the target of critical reporting.

That's not true. You can have Independent public broadcasting that is not owned by the government and is reporting critically on it.

Re: NY Times copyright suit wants OpenAI to delete all GPT instances

#295

Post by defrost »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #292
fodkodrasz wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is actually pirating content by companies for humongous profit, or pirating by individual human beings for free access to culture and entertainment, oftentimes for content one has already paid for, but rendered inaccessible by megacorporations.

Which content making businesses earn humorous profit margins? Are all the journalist layoffs a fever dream? This is one of the more profitable ones, and only because they employ unscrupulous tactics: https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/NWS/news/profit-ma... This is NYT, the most successful news business: https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/NYT/new-york-times... As for movies/tv show/music makers, let’s ju…

> Which content making businesses earn humorous profit margins?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mad_(magazine)

https://www.theonion.com/

Re: NY Times copyright suit wants OpenAI to delete all GPT instances

#296

Post by lupusreal »

hef19898 wrote: post #285
manojlds wrote: post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And add to that fact that NYT subscription is hard to unsubscribe from. People have aversion to NYT, even setting aside the bias.

It took me all of 5 minutes to cancel my digital NYT subscription from the following month onward. No idea what you are talking about.

Why did it take you five minutes instead of twenty seconds? It should be as simple as clicking on the link to your profile then clicking unsubscribe, mere seconds not minutes.

Assuming you just said five minutes figuratively... Do you live in California or some other legal jurisdiction that forces them to play nice? Did you subscribe through some other company, like Apple?

Horror stories about unsubscribing from the NYTimes are easy to find in the archive if you search for it. They make you call and chat to a retention specialist on the phone. This should help you have an idea of what he's talking about: https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&qu...

Re: NY Times copyright suit wants OpenAI to delete all GPT instances

#298

Post by puttycat »

munchinator wrote: post #180

It's interesting to me the ambiguous attitude people have to reproducing news content. Whenever there is a story from NYT on HN (or any other large media outlet), the top comment is almost always a link to an archived version which reproduces the text verbatim. And this seems to be tolerated as the norm. And yet, whenever there is a submission about a book, a TV show, a movie, a video game, an album, a comic book, or…

They pirate movies as well:

https://garymarcus.substack.com/p/an-artist-fights-back-and-...

Re: NY Times copyright suit wants OpenAI to delete all GPT instances

#299

Post by bongripper »

fodkodrasz wrote: post #289
JackFr wrote: post #265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> should be available to all participants of that society. Who pays?

The government (thus the people, in a so called sharing of public burden)! For example in Hungary there is an official news agency ran by the government, with (cumbersome) free access for everybody. Of course this does provide somewhat biased presentation of some facts, but on many topics it provides unbiased access to news for any citizen. This is actually pretty common in Europe, often funded by mandatory fees (for…

I agree with your general point but Hungary is probably the worst example you could have chosen from any EU country! The Orbán government is famously using it to spread propaganda and fake information in unprecedented levels.

The level of control governments exert on public broadcasting networks is widely different. Since Meloni, the RAI in Italy is facing similar issues, but Hungary is still the canonic example of government misinformation and propaganda.

Re: NY Times copyright suit wants OpenAI to delete all GPT instances

#300

Post by CJefferson »

logicchains wrote: post #115

NYT's perspective is going to look so stupid in future when we put LLMs into mechanical bodies with the ability to interact with the physical world, and to learn/update their weights live. It would make it completely illegal for such a robot to read/watch/listen to any copyrighted material; no watching TV, no reading library books, no browsing the internet, because in doing so it could memorise some copyrighted conte…

Are those LLMs independant citizens we are going to give rights to? Then I'm fine with that.

Are they all owned by one mega-corporation, which is going to do as capitalism does, and use them to squeeze money out of all of us? Then I'm happy to ban them.

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