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Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

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Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#491

Post by mensetmanusman »

Tostino wrote: post #468
xp84 wrote: post #463

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That would be quite effective IF it were tenable, but this is a solution in search of a revolution, lol (speaking strictly for the US). I wish I were joking, but politically you would have an easier time abolishing Christmas than something like this. Pitchforks would be wielded by 2 groups: 1. numbskulls who hate EVs because they believe that being able to add 400 miles of range in their F150 in 5 minutes (ie gasolin…

That second point is personally the sticking point for me. No reason the less-well-off should subsidize those who have the ability to purchase a new vehicle.

Most of the tax revenue does not come from the poor though. They could still be given EVs regardless.

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#492

Post by zackmorris »

gruez wrote: post #398
zackmorris wrote: post #200

This makes me sad in a way that's a little hard to articulate. But I'll try! I plug my $9000 2013 Nissan Leaf into an ordinary 120V extension cord each night so I can commute to a neighboring city for work, and the electricity costs me $20/mo. I also have a 1986 Toyota pickup like on Back to the Future that I had to gas up every other week, using 30 gallons of gas per month and costing over $100. So the operating cos…

>* Level 2 J1772 chargers have a resistor that tells the EV how much wattage to draw. But that just passes the buck to the user, who now must ensure that the outlet can provide that wattage. A better system would have a smart power manager that senses current saturation or voltage drop near the point where the circuit breaker trips. We also need smart breakers that add noise/harmonics/phase as they approach their lim…

Technically the lack of dynamic current negotiation is already a problem, because plugging a 20A refrigerator into a 15A circuit will trip the breaker or even start a fire in older homes if the owner decides to put a 20A fuse on a 15A circuit. We just don't normally see it, because most appliances like microwaves are designed for 1200-1800W (10-15A) running on 15A circuits.

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#493

Post by microtherion »

apexalpha wrote: post #135

I understand the ridicule that the EU gets sometimes, and especially so when trying to regulate stuff like AI where it seems the EU wants to regulate more than to create start ups etc... But this is one thing the EU just nailed the hammer into the wood immediatly, and rightly so. I can't even remember the time it was. Maybe 2013? 2014? They just set a standard and everyone, even Tesla, adopted it. Every single EV can…

In practice, it seems most charging stations I see here in Switzerland have 3 different plugs: AC, CCS DC, and CHAdeMO. And half of them have an attached cable and half are BYO.

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#494

Post by tempestn »

ianburrell wrote: post #248
gabrielhidasy wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

NACS supports either one or two phases for AC charging which would be used in most home chargers. A really high power charger would use DC with the AC/DC conversion happening before (and that could be from a three-phase source)

What the US has is split phase power, when one phase is 240V and that is split to make two 120V legs. NACS supports single phase power, either 120V (Level 1) or 240V (Level 2). There is no such thing as two-phase power, there is single-phase or three-phase. Since three-phase is better than two-phase.

You can look at it either way. "Phase" literally means the offset of the waveforms. With 3-phase, each of the phases is 120° out of sync. With split phase, you can look at it as a single, 240V phase with neutral in the middle, allowing it to be split into two 120V halves. Or you could look at it as two 120V phases, 180° out of sync, such that the difference between them is therefore 240V.

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#495

Post by kevin_thibedeau »

akouri wrote: post #195

I am the founder of Starlight Charging[1]. We are working on crazy-low-cost L2 chargers for multifamily apartments. Plug-and-charge is a sine-qua-non for us. One still major unsolved problem is the lack of agreement on a standard for payment/powerline communication from the EVSE to the vehicle. OCPP 2.0.1 and ISO 15118 is supposed to bring "Plug and Charge" capabilities -- this, in theory, would allow drivers to simp…

How will you pay with cash under such a regime? No EVs for the poor, let them eat cake.

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#496

Post by you-make-it »

kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #495
akouri wrote: post #195

I am the founder of Starlight Charging[1]. We are working on crazy-low-cost L2 chargers for multifamily apartments. Plug-and-charge is a sine-qua-non for us. One still major unsolved problem is the lack of agreement on a standard for payment/powerline communication from the EVSE to the vehicle. OCPP 2.0.1 and ISO 15118 is supposed to bring "Plug and Charge" capabilities -- this, in theory, would allow drivers to simp…

How will you pay with cash under such a regime? No EVs for the poor, let them eat cake.

Good idea. Go ahead and get started building that and let me know how it goes.

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#497

Post by RulerOf »

ska wrote: post #421
staplers wrote: post #408

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or ya know.. the pump, like has existed for decades..

I thought the problem was that it takes long enough that you aren't by the "pump" during process. Also that the chargepoints are likely less infrastructure than a pump. So something has to contact you (SMS/email/whatever)

Yeah... cars come with internet connections these days, I'd say it's the car's job.

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#498

Post by alexthornton »

akouri wrote: post #195

I am the founder of Starlight Charging[1]. We are working on crazy-low-cost L2 chargers for multifamily apartments. Plug-and-charge is a sine-qua-non for us. One still major unsolved problem is the lack of agreement on a standard for payment/powerline communication from the EVSE to the vehicle. OCPP 2.0.1 and ISO 15118 is supposed to bring "Plug and Charge" capabilities -- this, in theory, would allow drivers to simp…

EVerest is an open source project that solves for these sorts of interoperability challenges by integrating with all existing standards and making it easy to add new ones. Here's a brief video overview: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIsvUof3UWo. You can learn more here: https://lfenergy.org/projects/everest/.

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#499

Post by JumpCrisscross »

bluGill wrote: post #219
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> no reason other countries couldn't do that Yes, there are. A simple example is Latin America. Americans are willing to risk a recession, which predominantly falls on the poor, to stave off inflation. We’re slow to regulate and quick to let immigrate (even if we sing a song and dance about it, constantly) in a way most polities won’t tolerate. These come at costs that aren’t bearable for many, including in America.…

That is why they won't do it, not why they can't.

That’s closer to can’t than won’t. The political structure won’t permit it. We’re comparing sociopolitical systems; suspending the limitations of the society and polity makes the argument tautology.

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#500

Post by sitharus »

g_p wrote: post #460
VBprogrammer wrote: post #407

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For what it's worth, contactless is ubiquitous in the UK – the experience is almost always seamless. The only exception being the odd reader with the antenna in a stupid place (these have gotten less common over time) or when your bank decides to force a pin check.

How would paying for an EV charge work like this? Would you select an amount of credit in currency (presumably via buttons on the charger?) then tap-to-pay for that amount? (I believe there are some limitations on tap-to-pay transactions to prevent a merchant presenting the transaction with a different value after actually tapping the card.) I think a lot of "pay at pump" fuel stations require a full insertion of the…

Pay-at-pump is ubiquitous here in New Zealand, I don't think I've seen a station without it for years. This may be because around 90% of all retail transactions are done with payment cards here.

It's easy. You select the max amount (up to NZ$200), tap your card, and it's done. Pick up the right fuel nozzle, refuel, and go. Exactly the same can be done on EV chargers.

The process card-side is not a charge-and-refund as refunds have fees to the merchant. Rather it's a pre-authentication and finalisation. Pre-auth holds the funds for a set time (determined by the merchant agreement with the bank) and the vendor can finalise the charge up to the pre-authentication amount. Most hotels and car rental places do this for security deposits as well, if they don't charge or explicitly cancel your bank will release the fund hold at the end of the holding period.

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