Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's got a CE mark, but it's unclear if it's valid or not. This is a mandatory certification in the EU, like the UL listing in the US. The device is specifying the output voltage, which isn't in spec for the connector, but it is (apparently) accurate.
UL isn't actually mandatory in the US. The only thing mandatory that I am aware of is FCC certification for devices with signals over a certain number of Hz, and they wouldn't care about a USB port being abused.
My cat water fountain comes with a spicy USB power adapter
81–90 of 308 posts
Re: My cat water fountain comes with a spicy USB power adapter
#82Lidl does this too – the rotary tool Parkside PFBS 12 B3 comes with a charger that's obviously not USB-PD, but has an USB-C plug and it puts out a solid 13 volts at all times. (See https://www.kompernass.com/en/accessories/2316/charger-8 for an image.) I sent Lidl a courteous and long mail about this and they didn't really care other than "please open a service ticket with your local Lidl", which I didn't care to do…
Is there any EU body you can report them to?
Re: My cat water fountain comes with a spicy USB power adapter
#83Earlier quoted context omitted.
Great news! By the way, are you Finnish? I've never seen an 'O with tilde' character before.
Nope, Estonian. Quite close to Finnish but not quite the same. We do have all the õäöü-s that we need though.
I apparently need to map more. My head had some Mercator perversion where Finland and Estonia were a continent apart. Or maybe I don't do spheres well.
Re: My cat water fountain comes with a spicy USB power adapter
#84This is the sort of thing that almost (but not quite) pushes me to support mandatory certification (enforced by patents/other IP protections) for consumer devices that use a familiar connector like USB. Consumers shouldn’t need to worry about the specific output voltage; the presence of a USB-A connector should indicate that it abides by the specification. The hacker in me hates the idea of enforcing something like t…
> mandatory certification (enforced by patents/other IP protections)
> The hacker in me hates the idea
If the hacker in you really hates this, then why insist on enforcing via means that restrict both vendor and user freedom (IP) instead of regulatory enforcement that exclusively targets vendors & leaves hackers free to hack?
Re: My cat water fountain comes with a spicy USB power adapter
#85This is the sort of thing that almost (but not quite) pushes me to support mandatory certification (enforced by patents/other IP protections) for consumer devices that use a familiar connector like USB. Consumers shouldn’t need to worry about the specific output voltage; the presence of a USB-A connector should indicate that it abides by the specification. The hacker in me hates the idea of enforcing something like t…
I don't see how making sure that when something looks and quacks like a duck is actually a duck conflicts with the hacker ethos. The more standardized things are - the easier it is to build something. I love that I can take any combination of DIN parts and suppliers and know they will play nicely. Also there are a lot of standardized higher voltage connectors. this case is incompetence or negligence from manufacturer - and those are against everything hacking is about
Re: My cat water fountain comes with a spicy USB power adapter
#86This is the sort of thing that almost (but not quite) pushes me to support mandatory certification (enforced by patents/other IP protections) for consumer devices that use a familiar connector like USB. Consumers shouldn’t need to worry about the specific output voltage; the presence of a USB-A connector should indicate that it abides by the specification. The hacker in me hates the idea of enforcing something like t…
I think the thing that would let me stomach it is 1. Only legally mandating it for consumer devices / sold on the open market / commercial entities manufacturing it, or whatever the sensible way to structure that sentiment is, and 2. USB supports negotiating higher power settings, so you're not artificially limiting what's possible, just enforcing a safe worst case. If you need some USB connector that carries a kW you can theoretically still do that, you just have to not default to putting 100+ volts across the power pins the moment the thing is plugged in.
Re: My cat water fountain comes with a spicy USB power adapter
#87Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think when it comes to safety restrictions should be there. The hacker in me hates it too but just imagine if a small portion of standard-looking outlets did not output 220V (or whatever standard you have) and say 330V. Many applicances would break, or perhaps even catch fire. If there were many different USB-A devices and people were used to checking the voltage output before plugging, that might not be needed, bu…
> just imagine if a small portion of standard-looking outlets did not output 220V (or whatever standard you have) and say 330V. We have something like that here in Brazil. On cities which use 127V as the standard voltage (some cities use 220V), you can get 220V by using a pair of phases instead of a phase and the neutral, and it's common to find a few standard-looking sockets which are 220V instead of 127V. They migh…
Plus there’s 240V in Paraguay. I travel with cheap universal adapters and never have any problems.
Re: My cat water fountain comes with a spicy USB power adapter
#88Earlier quoted context omitted.
Good luck filing an insurance claim for damage caused by the use of a non-UL-listed appliance.
What language in an insurance policy requires the use of UL-listed appliances for coverage?
None.
Stuff like the post you are replying to is common "good luck with insurance" trope. Insurance protects you from stupidity, errors, and negligence. It doesn't protect you from fraud or intentional malice, but using an uncertified device is not fraud.
Note that after an accident related to personal stupidity or error, an insurance company could decide you are too risky to further insure, or that the cost for your insurance should increase dramatically. But they can't deny a claim.
All of this is of course a significant summary, but insurance won't (can't?) deny a claim linked to an uncertified electrical device in normal circumstances.
Re: My cat water fountain comes with a spicy USB power adapter
#89Lidl does this too – the rotary tool Parkside PFBS 12 B3 comes with a charger that's obviously not USB-PD, but has an USB-C plug and it puts out a solid 13 volts at all times. (See https://www.kompernass.com/en/accessories/2316/charger-8 for an image.) I sent Lidl a courteous and long mail about this and they didn't really care other than "please open a service ticket with your local Lidl", which I didn't care to do…
Report them to trading standards.
Re: My cat water fountain comes with a spicy USB power adapter
#90This is the sort of thing that almost (but not quite) pushes me to support mandatory certification (enforced by patents/other IP protections) for consumer devices that use a familiar connector like USB. Consumers shouldn’t need to worry about the specific output voltage; the presence of a USB-A connector should indicate that it abides by the specification. The hacker in me hates the idea of enforcing something like t…
I think the thing that would let me stomach it is 1. Only legally mandating it for consumer devices / sold on the open market / commercial entities manufacturing it, or whatever the sensible way to structure that sentiment is, and 2. USB supports negotiating higher power settings, so you're not artificially limiting what's possible, just enforcing a safe worst case. If you need some USB connector that carries a kW yo…
Re: 2: as you likely already know, this is a (major, pretty well thought out) part of newer usb standards. Unfortunately there’s no realistic way to backport this to older usb accessories. You can’t push an OTA update to the author’s wall wart.