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The "Cheap" Web

potato.cheap

11–20 of 230 posts

Re: The "Cheap" Web

#11
post #7

The thing that makes me disagree with proponents of the "smol"/"cheap"/etc Web is their totally misguided insistence on personal webpages as a sui generis medium for self-expression wrt layout and styling. > Until we adopt simple and stable building materials, all websites will continue to look the same. Yeah, big deal. Who cares if websites look the same? Wait, let me put that another way: we should care whether web…

You can have all web sites look the same by setting reader view as default in your browser. It is a great improvement for browsing the web, both on desktop and phone.

If somebody invented a "forum view" to make all forums look the same on our browsers, then I think the circle would be complete. It shouldn't be too difficult either, since most run on similar software.

Re: The "Cheap" Web

#12
post #7

The thing that makes me disagree with proponents of the "smol"/"cheap"/etc Web is their totally misguided insistence on personal webpages as a sui generis medium for self-expression wrt layout and styling. > Until we adopt simple and stable building materials, all websites will continue to look the same. Yeah, big deal. Who cares if websites look the same? Wait, let me put that another way: we should care whether web…

Author here! I largely agree with you.

I love Del Taco. I love the speed and consistency I get from franchises.

At the same time, my best friend recently sent me a picture of a fancy swordfish dish he cooked up, and I'm bummed that we don't get to see each other as often as we used to.

And as my daughter grows older, I'm becoming a bit frustrated at how difficult it is to purchase foods that were not doused in neurotic pesticides. So I'm learning how to grow our food.

Growing food isn't easy, but the farming community is cool, and I've been having a good time of it.

And so sometimes I wish building a website could be more like learning farming, and I think it could be.

Re: The "Cheap" Web

#13

the whole cheap/small web thing has me thinking of those people who buy used clothes but think nothing of paying $15 for a coffee at hipsterCafe. something virtue signally about it. maybe it's the "solarpunk philosophy" and the "synthesize serendipity"-ies or quoting steve jobs, one of the biggest a*holes in the history of tech (imo). although i agree strongly with everything here https://potato.cheap/#cheap

> people who shop at goodwill but think nothing of paying $15 for a coffee at hipsterCafe

I don't go in for fancy coffee with any regularity, but I do care a lot more about what goes in my body than what covers it, so I don't really see a contradiction here. Honestly, the older I get, things that may help my health (and I think there's a lot of "woo" there, but I think we can all agree that a decent restaurant is on average healthier than a McDonald's) are where I'm willing to spend money.

Re: The "Cheap" Web

#14
post #7

The thing that makes me disagree with proponents of the "smol"/"cheap"/etc Web is their totally misguided insistence on personal webpages as a sui generis medium for self-expression wrt layout and styling. > Until we adopt simple and stable building materials, all websites will continue to look the same. Yeah, big deal. Who cares if websites look the same? Wait, let me put that another way: we should care whether web…

> Who cares if websites look the same?

A lot of books look the same too, but that works pretty well for me tbh. I do not find books to be homogeneous as a result.

Re: The "Cheap" Web

#15

the whole cheap/small web thing has me thinking of those people who buy used clothes but think nothing of paying $15 for a coffee at hipsterCafe. something virtue signally about it. maybe it's the "solarpunk philosophy" and the "synthesize serendipity"-ies or quoting steve jobs, one of the biggest a*holes in the history of tech (imo). although i agree strongly with everything here https://potato.cheap/#cheap

> buy used clothes but think nothing of paying $15 for a coffee at hipsterCafe

The funny thing is Starbucks is by far the most expensive and crap quality coffee you can get most anywhere. "hipsterIndependentCafe" is consistently cheaper and better if you're a coffee snob.

Also people like me prefer to buy used as much as possible not to save money but to reduce waste. The romantics amongst us also prefer to have our goods well-storied

Re: The "Cheap" Web

#16
"Most websites should be compatible with screenreaders", and yet, the first line of text in the website is "♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡"; With the spoken form of: "Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart"

Re: The "Cheap" Web

#17

the whole cheap/small web thing has me thinking of those people who buy used clothes but think nothing of paying $15 for a coffee at hipsterCafe. something virtue signally about it. maybe it's the "solarpunk philosophy" and the "synthesize serendipity"-ies or quoting steve jobs, one of the biggest a*holes in the history of tech (imo). although i agree strongly with everything here https://potato.cheap/#cheap

>the whole cheap/small web thing has me thinking of those people who buy used clothes but think nothing of paying $15 for a coffee at hipsterCafe. something virtue signally about it.

Very often hipsterCafe commoditizes a demand for quality in food by offering something slightly better than average at five-fold the price, but I can see that hipster-vegan-bum would find themselves in a perfectly coherent way of life buying clothes from thrift shops and spending a lot for food, sourcing for ethical cooperatives or whatever. It may be a reflection of their privilege, it may be a virtue signal-ist modus operandi, but aren't contradictory habits.

>maybe it's the "solarpunk philosophy" and the "synthesize serendipity"-ies or quoting steve jobs, one of the biggest a*holes in the history of tech (imo).

Don't you think that Steve Jobs scammed a lot of artsy people selling them a dream of olistic tech and sustainability, and that it's perfectly sane and just for them to clasp at that dream and trying to realize it, rejecting the evils of the false prophet while not throwing the baby with the bathwater?

Re: The "Cheap" Web

#18
In a sense OP wants E-ink screens and org/vimwiki/markdown. Styling is where the problem it claims to criticize begins; if you want a truly accessible hypertext book, then you don't need styling, the user should be in charge of this, and the default theme would be whatever easily readable font, black on white, headings 36pt bold, paragraphs 14pt regular, every elements as blocks. Epub, in usage, is actually a cool format and I almost prefer this type of "browsing" experience than what websites proposes.

Or maybe OP wants higher level CSS and HTML, and this is a problem because this leads to the invention of a new language with yet another complex ontology that claims to be "simpler than its lower level counterpart" but is not.

   Of course you could create some markdown with basic styling options, but I am pretty sure learning basic html and css is not that more complex than learning that specific markdown and how to operate it to finally get a website served on a specific server.
Web and styling became complex exactly when occurred the encounter between what was styling on the web in the 2000s, the emergence of the nowadays variety of devices that are able to browse it and the actual way people interacted with smartphones.

Today our browsers are almost OSes and it's almost like the complexity of what you can share with them is superior than the complexity of you could create on a 1990 pc natively. I mean, you can run godot engine on your browser : you can develop prototypes of projects with your friends just for fun, create your own private platform for communicating with people you like.

I notice a lot of hate toward JS, but honestly when I first stumbled upon it I felt like a dream came true; it gives you the power to create experiences and share them almost effortlessly, and the fact that bigTechs decided to make boring websites on crazy over-engineered frameworks doesn't change anything to this.

Re: The "Cheap" Web

#19
post #7

The thing that makes me disagree with proponents of the "smol"/"cheap"/etc Web is their totally misguided insistence on personal webpages as a sui generis medium for self-expression wrt layout and styling. > Until we adopt simple and stable building materials, all websites will continue to look the same. Yeah, big deal. Who cares if websites look the same? Wait, let me put that another way: we should care whether web…

We're probably past the point in the web where formative experiments with layout are useful for most people, and most situations can be handled with a light CMS. That still leaves room for massive variance and personal control. Even just linktree levels of customization have a lot more spice than facebook. I think current big tech is still reacting to myspace allowing users to write raw CSS, and there's a lot of space for a swing back, especially given the current web's focus on "creators".

Re: The "Cheap" Web

#20

"Most websites should be compatible with screenreaders", and yet, the first line of text in the website is "♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡♥♡"; With the spoken form of: "Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart Heart…

My browser (Chrome 120) does correctly intuit that the header is not a landmark, so it at least won't be included in the landmark rotor. (In VO)

Still though, it would be ideal to remove that from a11y tree since it's totally useless in there.

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