So do these batteries still suffer from the same problem of permanent damage if completely discharged? That's the biggest thing that scares me away from buying a Tesla (well, that and the high price of Tesla Motors models).
IBM creates breathing, high-density, light-weight lithium-air battery
21–30 of 85 posts
Re: IBM creates breathing, high-density, light-weight lithium-air battery
#22Earlier quoted context omitted.
To add weight to your skepticism the article states, "Eventually (in another 10 years or so), li-ion batteries could be replaced with li-air batteries." !0 years is a long time-frame.
Exactly. 10 years is way past the Technological Event Horizon, which is about 2 years. Which means that unlike, for example, memristors, lithium air batteries most likely won't happen, and if they do happen, their happening will be a consequence of other research. (Which is an argument why most research should be fundamental and open-ended, i.e. not directed towards specific outcomes.)
If you follow Intel's R&D they have consistently gotten projects from 10-15 years out to come online on time.
Re: IBM creates breathing, high-density, light-weight lithium-air battery
#23This is slightly off topic but simply stated I just love IBM these days. There aren't many corporations that dedicate as much focus on research and yet, for a large corp. they also keep their nose surprisingly clean (these days). While we watch the swirling tech scandals ebb and flow they just quietly sit off to the side and keep changing the world.
I work for a help-desk part of IBM. We use IE6. :(
That should be very rare these days http://www.sutor.com/c/2010/07/ibm-moving-to-firefox-as-defa...
Re: IBM creates breathing, high-density, light-weight lithium-air battery
#24So ... As the battery is used, bonds are formed between oxygen molecules in the air, and the lithium ions on the battery's electrodes. Weight is saved by "borrowing" those O2s from the air, as compared to carrying them around fixed in an oxide. Fine. Does that mean that as the battery charge is depleted (=it runs out of free lithium ions, I guess), it's mass increases due to all the newly bound oxygen being stored in…
It reminds me of planting a tree in a pot, and then realizing in a few years the tree is a lot bigger and weighs a lot more than the pot when you started.
Re: IBM creates breathing, high-density, light-weight lithium-air battery
#25So ... As the battery is used, bonds are formed between oxygen molecules in the air, and the lithium ions on the battery's electrodes. Weight is saved by "borrowing" those O2s from the air, as compared to carrying them around fixed in an oxide. Fine. Does that mean that as the battery charge is depleted (=it runs out of free lithium ions, I guess), it's mass increases due to all the newly bound oxygen being stored in…
Imagine NASCAR with these batteries - Cars covered in solar panels. Drivers carefully timing their recharge pitstops to keep their weight down. Every fan in the stands has a big reflector to reflect sunlight at their favorite car.
I saw sunburned people blinding drivers and causing crashes.
Re: IBM creates breathing, high-density, light-weight lithium-air battery
#26So ... As the battery is used, bonds are formed between oxygen molecules in the air, and the lithium ions on the battery's electrodes. Weight is saved by "borrowing" those O2s from the air, as compared to carrying them around fixed in an oxide. Fine. Does that mean that as the battery charge is depleted (=it runs out of free lithium ions, I guess), it's mass increases due to all the newly bound oxygen being stored in…
Imagine NASCAR with these batteries - Cars covered in solar panels. Drivers carefully timing their recharge pitstops to keep their weight down. Every fan in the stands has a big reflector to reflect sunlight at their favorite car.
NASCAR fans are not very happy with "fuel mileage" races, and I would imagine what you describe would be far worse.
// also not very fond of people who say we watch for the wrecks
Re: IBM creates breathing, high-density, light-weight lithium-air battery
#27This is slightly off topic but simply stated I just love IBM these days. There aren't many corporations that dedicate as much focus on research and yet, for a large corp. they also keep their nose surprisingly clean (these days). While we watch the swirling tech scandals ebb and flow they just quietly sit off to the side and keep changing the world.
I work for a help-desk part of IBM. We use IE6. :(
As an IE7 user in work, finally I can gloat! (no, actually, it's shit)
Re: IBM creates breathing, high-density, light-weight lithium-air battery
#28When these can be used in laptops it would give a whole no meaning to "MacBook Air" - Sorry couldn't resist.
Re: IBM creates breathing, high-density, light-weight lithium-air battery
#29Sorry to be skeptical, but I can't help but think: Number of "battery breakthrough" news I heard in the last 15 years: >100, Actual battery breakthroughs: 0
I'm running a thinkpad with an 8 hour (theoretical) maximum battery life. Actually it's like 5 or 6. But the model from a year or two years before that would have only gotten 1-2 hours battery life. So improvements are being made and we're seeing them. It's just slow going.
A lo of that improvement must also be from chips consuming less and more RAM resulting in no need for paging.
Re: IBM creates breathing, high-density, light-weight lithium-air battery
#30Sorry to be skeptical, but I can't help but think: Number of "battery breakthrough" news I heard in the last 15 years: >100, Actual battery breakthroughs: 0
Actually, there have been. Leaving aside the constant improvements in batteries that are ongoing: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium-ion_battery#Modern_batt... There have also been breakthroughs in the last five years to allow for massively faster charging: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium-ion_polymer_battery#Tec...
We've been spoiled by Moore's Law in technology. In comparison, all the "battery breakthroughs" of the past decade are pretty feeble. If someone could double or triple the energy density of a battery, that would be a breakthrough.
Unfortunately, there's another discipline where energy density is important: explosives. The critical difference is in how quickly the energy is released, and as Li-Ion batteries show it isn't always as controllable as we'd like.