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Fastmail Employees Form a Union

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Re: Fastmail Employees Form a Union

#51

Post by capitol_ »

mfer wrote: post #6

Unions are fascinating to me. When you are in a Union, part of your money goes to the union in order to, hopefully, make things better for you. This means the relationship between Union leadership and the Union members is just as important as between Union leadership and the company. Historically, we have seen Unions bring things like worker safety to the forefront and do numerous things to help people out. More rece…

That could be a long play from the employer side to disincentivize the workers from joining forming/joining a union.

Re: Fastmail Employees Form a Union

#52

Post by EdwardDiego »

haolez wrote: post #18
mfer wrote: post #6

Unions are fascinating to me. When you are in a Union, part of your money goes to the union in order to, hopefully, make things better for you. This means the relationship between Union leadership and the Union members is just as important as between Union leadership and the company. Historically, we have seen Unions bring things like worker safety to the forefront and do numerous things to help people out. More rece…

Unions are really powerful in corrupt and underdeveloped countries. Correlation is not causation, but still, it's frustrating for workers in those regions.

Like, Australia?

Re: Fastmail Employees Form a Union

#53

Post by niels8472 »

haolez wrote: post #18
mfer wrote: post #6

Unions are fascinating to me. When you are in a Union, part of your money goes to the union in order to, hopefully, make things better for you. This means the relationship between Union leadership and the Union members is just as important as between Union leadership and the company. Historically, we have seen Unions bring things like worker safety to the forefront and do numerous things to help people out. More rece…

Unions are really powerful in corrupt and underdeveloped countries. Correlation is not causation, but still, it's frustrating for workers in those regions.

The least corrupt countries per the corruption perceptions index also (mostly) have strong unions.

Danmark and Finland topping the list have 70% membership.

Re: Fastmail Employees Form a Union

#54

Post by ztetranz »

brightball wrote: post #38
taurath wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would always rather be in a union than not. Sometimes unions can be opaque or byzantine especially in older industries, but what is always opaque is management. Having fair pay and time off is something I’d rather not leave to whoever happens to sit in the chair above me, because who sits in the chair above me can change on a whim. Congrats to the Fastmail team!

As long as there's an option to not be in the union, it's completely fine IMO. In a free market, the best option will win. When non-union jobs are better than union jobs the need for the union should vanish (in theory).

>In a free market, the best option will win.

I'm not sure if you mean that generally or just around employment and unions.

If you mean it generally then, just as a random example, should we make emission control on cars an optional extra? Let the free market customer decide if they want to pay extra for a catalytic converter.

Re: Fastmail Employees Form a Union

#55

Post by nonrandomstring »

user3939382 wrote: post #29
mfer wrote: post #6

Unions are fascinating to me. When you are in a Union, part of your money goes to the union in order to, hopefully, make things better for you. This means the relationship between Union leadership and the Union members is just as important as between Union leadership and the company. Historically, we have seen Unions bring things like worker safety to the forefront and do numerous things to help people out. More rece…

What we need are Unions Squared. It’s a union for the union. If the first level union isn’t fighting for the workers they lose their membership. But… what if the second level union fails…

Unions tend amalgamate in much the way companies acquire.

In Britain we've had, and still have, some quite powerful unions that formed from smaller groups in the 1970s, notably the Transport and General Workers' Union [0].

Also, unions naturally cooperate and support each other forming a formidable power bloc. My 1980s memories are of Flying Pickets and Solidarity. Indeed, in Poland, Lech Walesa's Solidarity [1] was arguably a key domino in the events leading to the overthrow of communism in East Europe.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transport_and_General_Workers%...

[1] https://www.britannica.com/biography/Lech-Walesa

Re: Fastmail Employees Form a Union

#56

Post by brightball »

vlovich123 wrote: post #49
brightball wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As long as there's an option to not be in the union, it's completely fine IMO. In a free market, the best option will win. When non-union jobs are better than union jobs the need for the union should vanish (in theory).

You realize how collective bargaining breaks down when you aren’t a united front right?

If you are forced to be in the union, you're not united...you're coerced. If you choose to be, you are.

Re: Fastmail Employees Form a Union

#57

Post by toomuchtodo »

brightball wrote: post #38
taurath wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would always rather be in a union than not. Sometimes unions can be opaque or byzantine especially in older industries, but what is always opaque is management. Having fair pay and time off is something I’d rather not leave to whoever happens to sit in the chair above me, because who sits in the chair above me can change on a whim. Congrats to the Fastmail team!

As long as there's an option to not be in the union, it's completely fine IMO. In a free market, the best option will win. When non-union jobs are better than union jobs the need for the union should vanish (in theory).

The evidence doesn’t support this claim, and is why over 1000 VW workers in Tennessee indicated their intent to join the UAW after the UAW won historic benefits from automakers.

Re: Fastmail Employees Form a Union

#58

Post by zbyte64 »

vlovich123 wrote: post #49
brightball wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As long as there's an option to not be in the union, it's completely fine IMO. In a free market, the best option will win. When non-union jobs are better than union jobs the need for the union should vanish (in theory).

You realize how collective bargaining breaks down when you aren’t a united front right?

I don't understand how people perceive corporations as an individual that seeks to negotiate with you on neutral grounds.

Re: Fastmail Employees Form a Union

#60

Post by TulliusCicero »

nightski wrote: post #10
righthand wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because software workers should start looking to form unions as large companies take to stagnate wages with large hire/layoff cycles that flood the employment market.

You can't unionize your way to a better economy, that's not how that works.

I view unionizing as less about making the overall economy stronger, and more about sharing the rewards of a strong economy more equally.

The US economy is, for instance, quite strong overall. GDP per capita is high, substantially higher than other large nations like Japan, Germany, or France. The problem the average US worker faces is not that the economy overall is bad, but rather many issues of varying severity related to inequality and job security, like how they could be fired for almost any reason, legally speaking.

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