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For those who just read the title: the "fuse" doesn't stop the cpu from working, it's just a flag for AMD support to know that the chip has been overclocked and this might invalidate the warranty.
I remembered the Xbox 360 processor also had eFuses: https://free60.org/Hardware/Fusesets/
https://consolemods.org/wiki/Xbox_360:Disabling_the_eFuse_Bu... (see Method 2)
Earlier quoted context omitted.
It mostly just cripples the secondary market for used server hardware.
I dont see the economics of splitting servers for parts. Aside from pulling drives for shredding, servers are mostly sold as pulled on the aftermarket
Earlier quoted context omitted.
It mostly just cripples the secondary market for used server hardware.
I dont see the economics of splitting servers for parts. Aside from pulling drives for shredding, servers are mostly sold as pulled on the aftermarket
Of all the CPUs I have had not a single one broke from use before they were replaced due to obsolescence and I definitely have been pushing them. How common is CPUs being permanently damaged from reasonable overclocking anyway, especially modern ones that have integrated sensors and clock themselves down automatically?
With the smaller process sizes there's less voltage tolerance before degradation occurs. The X3D chips from AMD pack things supposedly pack the cache so tightly that it's easy to get into trouble
A lot of chips burned out with something relatively mild like 1.3V on the SOC!
That protection is fairly limited. There aren't enough sensors for everything that's heat sensitive. Reducing voltages/clock speeds also may not be enough to save all of those.
Very long way to say: not that common... but decently.
edit: As Paul mentions in a peer comment, this is largely due to the memory controller being moved onto the CPU.
Of all the CPUs I have had not a single one broke from use before they were replaced due to obsolescence and I definitely have been pushing them. How common is CPUs being permanently damaged from reasonable overclocking anyway, especially modern ones that have integrated sensors and clock themselves down automatically?
I had a 9900K fail due to XMP, no other overclocking.
Why don't they just put some thermal feedback system in it, making the chip inherently safe?
Thermal throttling has been a thing for a long time.
* on
* idling
* at room temperature
Current passing through conductors wears them down. More current or heat means faster.
What's more, there aren't enough sensors (or room to put them) for every heat-sensitive component.
For those who just read the title: the "fuse" doesn't stop the cpu from working, it's just a flag for AMD support to know that the chip has been overclocked and this might invalidate the warranty.
On a related note, AMD's EPYC CPUs have eFuses that enforce a vendor lock. This means you can't transfer an EPYC CPU from, say, a Dell server to a Lenovo server. https://www.servethehome.com/amd-psb-vendor-locks-epyc-cpus-...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bFNJVaO9E-o&t=215
not only is this removing a cheap source of upgrades for consumers and sending it to e-waste instead, but it's going to pollute the consumer secondhand market in the same way, once AMD starts getting more traction in OEM sales.
just like with epyc, you will need to wade through piles of "HP ryzen" and "Dell ryzen" and find the one that didn't list it as locked. Oops, still locked anyway, that seller just didn't list it properly.
people are gonna wake up one day and realize the secondhand market is completely fuckered, OEMs sell a lot more PCs to businesses than consumers, there is a disproportionate amount of volume that's going to be locked when things start getting parted out. Again, "fortunately" AMD didn't have much traction with OEMs during the AM4 years but AM5 is going to be a real mess.
For those who just read the title: the "fuse" doesn't stop the cpu from working, it's just a flag for AMD support to know that the chip has been overclocked and this might invalidate the warranty.
I remembered the Xbox 360 processor also had eFuses: https://free60.org/Hardware/Fusesets/
Earlier quoted context omitted.
On a related note, AMD's EPYC CPUs have eFuses that enforce a vendor lock. This means you can't transfer an EPYC CPU from, say, a Dell server to a Lenovo server. https://www.servethehome.com/amd-psb-vendor-locks-epyc-cpus-...
this isn't just limited to epyc either, it's in the consumer platform as well, and it applies to non-pro cpus that have been used in branded systems. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bFNJVaO9E-o&t=215 not only is this removing a cheap source of upgrades for consumers and sending it to e-waste instead, but it's going to pollute the consumer secondhand market in the same way, once AMD starts getting more traction in OEM…
If they did such a thing with car components, it would be shut down in no time. No different for computer parts.
Also a CPU that can be rendered permanently inoperable due to a software issue could be considered not fit for purpose and thus a defective product. Especially if it was intentionally designed this way - such that the CPU can self-cripple itself.
Maybe a legal firm would want to take up a class action against AMD for this potential product defect? Viruses and malware should not be able to physically destroy a CPU. There should be physical hardware protections against such destructive behaviour occurring due to a software induced logic error.
The PSP is not truly secure, someone should write a PSP eFuse bricker tool (Ryzenkill?) that can be run as a proof of concept to show the CPUs are defective, and then we can have a recall or free replacement of the CPU by AMD. I'll look into it myself - I need to ensure it's legal for me to write it from the country that I'm residing in right now. I personally have extensive experience hacking older AMD processors and GPUs through JTAG.
I'm sure it's still legal to provide a list of addresses and data writes that you need to perform to permanently brick the CPU?. I don't think that is classed as a "hacking tool". I can get t-shirts printed with it on, together with the words "AMD Ryzen CPU Self-Destruct Sequence". I don't think selling those would be illegal?
Earlier quoted context omitted.
I dont see the economics of splitting servers for parts. Aside from pulling drives for shredding, servers are mostly sold as pulled on the aftermarket
however shocking you may find it, typing “epyc cpu” into eBay will nonetheless produce quite a few results. this used to be even bigger in the Xeon days. Being able to drop in a $50 upgrade to x99 and get the 2-3 best chip in socket owns actually. X99 isn't bad if you've got a 18-core chip running at 3.8 ghz all-core (with all-core turbo enhancement), and you can address 256GB of memory in a consumer board with dirt-…