GM says it's dropping Apple CarPlay and Android Auto because they're unsafe • Hacker News Board

Re: GM says it's dropping Apple CarPlay and Android Auto because they're unsafe

#151

Post by 65a » Wed, Dec 13, 2023, 6:35 AM UTC

kelnos wrote: post #33

I've never owned a car made by GM, but a decision like this guarantees I never will. I don't buy their take that the safety issues are because Android Auto and CarPlay are buggy and have connection issues and other crap that cause people to use their phone directly. I've only had a new enough car to use Android Auto for a year and half now, but I've literally never encountered a bug that required me to touch my phone…

> guaranteed they're going to stop releasing updates for each car's version of it within 5-10 years of the car's release

That's probably a feature and not a bug to them, since it damages the value or desirability of used vehicles.

Re: GM says it's dropping Apple CarPlay and Android Auto because they're unsafe

#152

Post by eviks » Wed, Dec 13, 2023, 6:35 AM UTC

kmlx wrote: post #121

ungamedplayer wrote: post #4

Call it what it is.. they like the control of their in car entertainment systems and they don't want external companies taking that part of the pie. It's okay gm, we understand. Let's hope you are able to make a compelling competition to this, otherwise your sales will suffer. Traditional car software is very very poor for whatever reason. I don't think that car manufacturers have the mindset and capability to make e…

> Call it what it is.. they like the control of their in car entertainment systems and they don't want external companies taking that part of the pie. they did call it as it is. it's in the article: > In addition to potentially buying things from GM or GM’s partners through their car’s infotainment system, GM is also looking at subscription services that would be managed through the same interface. GM’s chief digital…

They didn't call it as it is, that's just the obvious conclusion the author of the article makes based on another source, they make up unverified safety allegations

> though Babbitt admits that GM hasn’t exactly tested this in a controlled setting to see whether or not it’s true.

Re: GM says it's dropping Apple CarPlay and Android Auto because they're unsafe

#153

Post by pankajdoharey » Wed, Dec 13, 2023, 6:37 AM UTC

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #94

ungamedplayer wrote: post #4

Call it what it is.. they like the control of their in car entertainment systems and they don't want external companies taking that part of the pie. It's okay gm, we understand. Let's hope you are able to make a compelling competition to this, otherwise your sales will suffer. Traditional car software is very very poor for whatever reason. I don't think that car manufacturers have the mindset and capability to make e…

Tesla is the exception here: they seem to have mastered making a car software experience that doesn’t suck, and they don’t even support CarPlay. But Tesla is a tech/software company that happens to make cars (of dubious build quality), I don’t think conventional automakers can replicate that.

No its a car company which writes its own software. Their primary business in not software its cars. Although i agree they are not very good at it, the build quality is obviously dubious. Perhaps the Know how of old car companies + Tesla's battery and Motor tech + Software could result in an overall better product. A merger would be a net positive IMO.

Re: GM says it's dropping Apple CarPlay and Android Auto because they're unsafe

#154

Post by seanmcdirmid » Wed, Dec 13, 2023, 6:37 AM UTC

verhaust wrote: post #124

andsoitis wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla software experience far outshines CarPlay and Android Auto.

Can you give examples of this? I was recently looking for a car and saw the discounts and credits for a Tesla and thought it was finally time to go electric. Then I started researching the interface and saw so many people talking about how clunky it was and they decided to just use bluetooth with their phone to listen to music rather than the interface or even worse hacks where they setup a web server on their phone…

I bought a BMW i4, not a Tesla 3, so this is just my comparison. But Tesla software works really well, they have navigation to chargers, something that doesn’t really work in the BMW, you are pretty much on your own. They have sentinal mode, and it actually doesn’t suck like BMW’s drive recorder does. You can open your car with your phone, like for real via UWB, not just some NFC thing that works only in one place, or over the slow cellular unlock. I guess I didn’t explore the Spotify/music streaming experience.

I still chose the BMW because the better interior and build quality, but it was definitely a sacrifice.

Re: GM says it's dropping Apple CarPlay and Android Auto because they're unsafe

#155

Post by nneonneo » Wed, Dec 13, 2023, 6:38 AM UTC

pkulak wrote: post #72

I don’t like hooking my car up to my phone. And I generally like in-car nav. Google Maps has ads, bugs me to report accidents, routes through neighborhoods to save 30 seconds, and won’t show up in a HUD or binnacle. All I want is a good way to enter a destination, Bluetooth support, and I’m happy. I remember hearing that Audi can use What Three Words, or some similar scheme? That’s my ideal. My Volvo has a phone app…

Google Maps for CarPlay has never shown me any ads nor bothered me to report any accidents. The phone app does, but never when I'm driving.

For what it's worth, if Google Maps isn't what you like, you can use any other maps app with real-time directions; Apple Maps (obviously) works fantastically well on iPhones (and in suitably large cities), and you can also pick others like Waze, OSM, TomTom, etc.

We previously had a car that required the in-car nav to be updated at the dealer annually, as part of their service package. It felt like a quaint thing to have to do. I guess the alternative is that the car has some connectivity so it can download updates by itself?

Re: GM says it's dropping Apple CarPlay and Android Auto because they're unsafe

#156

Post by bastard_op » Wed, Dec 13, 2023, 6:38 AM UTC

Automobile companies tried for years to make a decent infotainment system in cars, and almost universally they were all terrible no matter how expensive the vehicle. Finally Android Auto and CarPlay gave everyone what they wanted - decent access to music on their phone, call capabilities that actually work, and program integration with things they actually use with internet service they already have.

Then manufacturers realized they were losing control to Google and Apple, and want it back. So now I guess we're back to random garbage half-baked solutions that no one likes, just so they can sell subscriptions for seat heaters and music players. Back to the walled gardens everyone, move along.

I'll never buy a new vehicle again, particularly GM now, and simply stick to something older I can either put any standard double-din deck into, or a vehicle with 3rd party mods that then add Android Auto like my Infiniti that shipped with the worst infotainment system ever.

Re: GM says it's dropping Apple CarPlay and Android Auto because they're unsafe

#157

Post by bluefirebrand » Wed, Dec 13, 2023, 6:39 AM UTC

pmg102 wrote: post #146

bluefirebrand wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am dreading the future of cars, where they somehow are worse than a car I could buy right now but also I have to pay a monthly subscription for the worse experience. The enshittification of everything is making me want to go berserk.

There's no obligation to buy a new one. Keep your existing cars on the road or replace them with other low mileage used ones. I bet repair costs on used are less than depreciatiom + finance costs on new, and there's pleasure to be gained from a retro aesthetic.

Sure, I plan to drive my current car until the wheels fall off, but that's not the point.

I'm young enough that I will very likely need to buy a new-to-me car eventually, and there's a good chance that by then a lot of the used cars out there will be the enshitted versions. I'm not looking forward to it.

Re: GM says it's dropping Apple CarPlay and Android Auto because they're unsafe

#158

Post by nneonneo » Wed, Dec 13, 2023, 6:44 AM UTC

noirbot wrote: post #82

clipsy wrote: post #69

Genuine question: Are there any auto manufacturers that do a good job of just supporting CarPlay and Android Auto and getting out of the way?

I haven't had any real issues with Mazda over the years? I got it installed by them on a 10 year old car a few years ago and had no issues that weren't "the entire system wouldn't turn on" issues with a flaky battery or heat/cold extremes. The initial load time isn't stellar, but it loads into the phone interface cleanly and all the physical car buttons interface well with the phone. No complaints.

Second this, I am extremely happy with CarPlay on my Mazda. There are lots of physical controls that just work naturally with CarPlay. No need to use touch controls!

Re: GM says it's dropping Apple CarPlay and Android Auto because they're unsafe

#159

Post by stephen_g » Wed, Dec 13, 2023, 6:44 AM UTC

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #94

ungamedplayer wrote: post #4

Call it what it is.. they like the control of their in car entertainment systems and they don't want external companies taking that part of the pie. It's okay gm, we understand. Let's hope you are able to make a compelling competition to this, otherwise your sales will suffer. Traditional car software is very very poor for whatever reason. I don't think that car manufacturers have the mindset and capability to make e…

Tesla is the exception here: they seem to have mastered making a car software experience that doesn’t suck, and they don’t even support CarPlay. But Tesla is a tech/software company that happens to make cars (of dubious build quality), I don’t think conventional automakers can replicate that.

My impression of Tesla (from driving a friend's, who is a massive Tesla fan) is that I get the feeling that the systems aren't as clever as they think they are, and it led to some "interesting" (actually downright scary and dangerous) experiences with the driver assist functions on a long distance drive we did. It wasn't the full Autopilot, just the lane following/adaptive cruise control kind of thing but we almost did go off the road at least once.

But in general with the UI, there was a lot of, "Hey, how do I do [elementary car function]" and he'd be like "Oh I think they changed that [or moved it in the menu] in the last update, uh let me have a look"...

Elon Musk's antics had already basically made me decide my next car wouldn't be a Tesla, but driving one a bit didn't really sell me on it anyway...

Re: GM says it's dropping Apple CarPlay and Android Auto because they're unsafe

#160

Post by verhaust » Wed, Dec 13, 2023, 6:46 AM UTC

andruby wrote: post #139

verhaust wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you give examples of this? I was recently looking for a car and saw the discounts and credits for a Tesla and thought it was finally time to go electric. Then I started researching the interface and saw so many people talking about how clunky it was and they decided to just use bluetooth with their phone to listen to music rather than the interface or even worse hacks where they setup a web server on their phone…

My personal opinion: 1. The navigation works really well for me. Including routing via superchargers 2. The UX of not needing a key. The bluetooth phone key works so much more reliably than other car manufacturers (n=1) 3. The screen is very responsive. Touch UI is fast. 4. The backup and side camera view is the best I’ve seen on cars. 5. Record the last X minutes from all cameras when you honk (someone backed into m…

2-8 do sound great. They are the reasons I was looking at a Tesla. Hadn't even heard of some of those. The car I'm looking to replace is a 2009 toyota corolla commuter car that is really starting to have maintenance issues. The right speakers even stopped working a few years ago. The speaker on my phone is better so I just put the sound all the way up and use that. The audio sucks, but it's easy. I sit down, press play, and I'm listening to what I want.

My wife's CRV is a 2018 which I only drive when we are driving long distances. Still, I just plug my phone in and all my data is there on android auto. I have starred places on google maps going back almost 15 years. I click a place on recents and it maps me there. I press shuffle on youtube music and it has all my history there to play through. Youtube music also has the download option so I can play music in non-signal areas. That was another thing I couldn't seem to find an answer for with a Tesla. Does spotify work without a signal? If so, how much storage does the tesla offer to spotify? I have multi-gigs of downloaded music on my phone. We hit 30+ minute terrible signal areas on our holiday travels to family.

The options seemed to be switch my apps to spotify/tesla navigation for "car riding" and have to double-entry everything from my home-listening or completely switchover. Which could maybe work for spotify (does that have the same option to upload your own music that google music had?), but definitely wouldn't work for tesla navigation. Then there's the privacy concerns that I'm now sharing more data with two places rather than one. Then the added monthly fee of using Tesla's data plan vs. android auto being free. All that made me think that getting a tesla would only increase my annoyances and costs rather than providing me a benefit. The advantages you listed are really, really nice, but hard to justify with the rest of it.