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To revive Portland, officials seek to ban public drug use

nytimes.com

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Re: To revive Portland, officials seek to ban public drug use

#411

Post by dylan604 »

namesbc wrote: post #127
qingcharles wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is such a hard problem to solve. I work with drug and alcohol addicts regularly and addiction is such a damned nightmare. And every homeless person hates shelters. They have way more rules than prisons and all of the drama. I don't know what the solutions are :(

Permanent Housing is the only solution. Shelters are at best temporary to survive a cold night, but they are not a solution for a sustainable life.

The only solution to what? While it might get the off the street, it will not cure the addiction. Are you then going to say that someone must be sober before receiving housing? So, again, what is it solving that it is the only thing that can solve it?

Re: To revive Portland, officials seek to ban public drug use

#412

Post by Aurornis »

BizarreByte wrote: post #301
felizuno wrote: post #168

So much sympathy for drug users and business owners, but what about the private citizens who get victimized by these drug users? I was beaten nearly to death (in broad daylight, in a residential neighborhood) in Seattle in 2020 by two men enabled to descend into meth addiction by permissive policies. In my victim support group I met so many people - innocent people - permanently injured & disfigured like me, or raped…

I'm a Canadian who travelled to Seattle recently and I found that city legitimately scary downtown. The addicts were unstable and violent like nothing I'd ever seen, even in some of the worst parts of our country. Walking through downtown Seattle at night with a suitcase trying to find my hotel is the first time in my life I thought I was about to be attacked or robbed, but thankfully I only had stuff thrown at me by…

I'm an American with decades of history traveling to West coast cities.

Portland and Seattle in the past few years look completely different than they did even a few years ago. Both cities have always had run down parts, but now it feels like the blight permeates almost everything. Some of my favorite places to visit have either closed entirely or now have limited hours and require me to buzz in at the front door so someone can visually verify that I'm not a threat. I can't explain how strange it feels for this shift to have happened in a matter of years.

Re: To revive Portland, officials seek to ban public drug use

#413

Post by briffle »

margalabargala wrote: post #221
ratg13 wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think other cities bussing and flying homeless people out west outweighs every possible policy change. We’ll never know if any of these policies stood a chance due to the USA viewing the west coast as a dumping ground for homeless people. Next time you’re passing by these people, ask them where they are from originally. Locals are like 20% of the problem.

Where I live (central Oregon), this is not the case. More than 80% of our homeless population are people that were born and raised here, and were priced out of housing and onto the streets due to housing prices skyrocketing to eyewatering levels. It has tripled in the last ten years, with a 1-br apartment going for under $600 in 2013 now going for $1700. The homelessness here is homegrown, not imported. Portland is b…

Not sure if they still do, but Eugene used to buy you a one-way bus ticket to Portland or Salem and some food vouchers if you claimed to have family there. They didn’t really verify.

Re: To revive Portland, officials seek to ban public drug use

#414

Post by bloaf »

randombits0 wrote: post #404
Aurornis wrote: post #392

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Just legalize it and let people get pure product at dirt cheap prices. Having traveled to Portland recently and witnessed the public drug problem first hand, I have no idea how anyone would think that increasing availability of the drugs would improve the situation. The only thing legalization and widespread availability would help is reducing deaths from tainted drugs. While that is a significant problem, anything…

The biggest problem with dying by overdose is measuring the dose. Legal drugs presume quality control and standardized dosing. This, alone, could prevent the majority of opioid deaths.

You're missing the point. If you're a politician, "making drug addicts not poison themselves" is a nice-to-have, but "making drug users not victimize others" is basically mandatory. Zero political parties are going to win on a platform of "its ok that drug addicts are making the streets unsafe, the real problem is that their drugs are not affordable or high enough quality."

Re: To revive Portland, officials seek to ban public drug use

#415

Post by Aurornis »

rjbwork wrote: post #324
chmod600 wrote: post #305

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What does "legalize and regulate" mean? Isn't that true of most drugs? We are talking about what those regulations should be and what to do when people break the regulations.

Probably as many regulations as there are on alcohol or tobacco or pharmaceuticals (which I'm also not a fan of the doctor/pharmaceutical gated access to other drugs). If you produce it has to be pure, tested, not adulterated, with standards for production facilities. If you consume, only in particular establishments or at home, and you can't drive while under the influence. If someone breaks those regulations, then…

> If you consume, only in particular establishments or at home,

I think you're imagining a hypothetical scenario that doesn't match the problems described in the article.

Portland isn't having problems with crime and homelessness because responsible adults are consuming moderate amounts of drugs from the comfort of their homes on the weekends.

> If someone breaks those regulations, then they face similar kinds of penalties as people who produce and consume alcohol would.

I think you've missed the point of the article and what's being discussed. Decriminalizing drug use means removing those penalties, which has resulted in widespread public drug use in those cities.

Re: To revive Portland, officials seek to ban public drug use

#416

Post by sickofparadox »

KennyBlanken wrote: post #382
felizuno wrote: post #335

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Surprisingly yes, they were caught with much credit and appreciation to the detectives of SPD. In fact the police were very helpful in accessing support and counseling, and I should be completely honest that I would have described myself as loosely "anti police" until I had this experience. The issue was simply that these men were psychotic after using meth in an uninterrupted fashion, and emboldened by the fact that…

[flagged]

This rhetoric has only increased the suffering in the world and filled cities with an underclass of vagrants too drugged out to tell you the day of the week. People shouldn't go to jail for weed, fine, fair enough. But all you see in cities that have decriminalized harder drugs are frozen in time drug zombies. It's a terrible policy every time it's implemented in the States, but people are more concerned with the feel-good vibes of the policy.

Re: To revive Portland, officials seek to ban public drug use

#417

Post by nradov »

KennyBlanken wrote: post #382
felizuno wrote: post #335

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Surprisingly yes, they were caught with much credit and appreciation to the detectives of SPD. In fact the police were very helpful in accessing support and counseling, and I should be completely honest that I would have described myself as loosely "anti police" until I had this experience. The issue was simply that these men were psychotic after using meth in an uninterrupted fashion, and emboldened by the fact that…

[flagged]

People who are in prison are not out committing more crimes.

We do need to reduce the prison population, but by the time someone has reached the point of heavy drug use and street violence the odds of rehabilitation are very low. No other country has a good record of rehabilitating those people. So, the only reasonable way to reduce the problem is further upstream with better opportunities and support systems for youths.

Re: To revive Portland, officials seek to ban public drug use

#418

Post by pokerface_86 »

Aerbil313 wrote: post #13

Criminalization works, even without sniffing dogs and modern surveillance, when the crime is also a sin . See Islam. To this day I know no relative or close friend of mine who ever drank any alcohol, nor one which used any drugs. But ofc this is the unthinkable for West. Downvote, pass.

[dead]

Re: To revive Portland, officials seek to ban public drug use

#419

Post by Inward »

felizuno wrote: post #168

So much sympathy for drug users and business owners, but what about the private citizens who get victimized by these drug users? I was beaten nearly to death (in broad daylight, in a residential neighborhood) in Seattle in 2020 by two men enabled to descend into meth addiction by permissive policies. In my victim support group I met so many people - innocent people - permanently injured & disfigured like me, or raped…

Stay strapped. Sorry to be harsh, but it’s not policies that keep you and yours safe. You need to protect you and yours and government policies aren’t going to protect you from hard drug users. Sorry you had a terrible experience but since ancient times people have weapons to defend against any enemy.

Re: To revive Portland, officials seek to ban public drug use

#420

Post by ars »

KennyBlanken wrote: post #361
felizuno wrote: post #168

So much sympathy for drug users and business owners, but what about the private citizens who get victimized by these drug users? I was beaten nearly to death (in broad daylight, in a residential neighborhood) in Seattle in 2020 by two men enabled to descend into meth addiction by permissive policies. In my victim support group I met so many people - innocent people - permanently injured & disfigured like me, or raped…

[flagged]

Just take away their meth. That's it. All the rest of what you wrote is just pointless exaggeration.
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