Epic vs. Google: Google Loses • Hacker News Board

Re: Epic vs. Google: Google Loses

#41

Post by solardev » Tue, Dec 12, 2023, 1:01 AM UTC

meepmorp wrote: post #12

wnevets wrote: post #8

Didn't Apple effectively win their lawsuit while having an actual monopoly on iPhone app installs? Can someone explain why Google lost despite android having all sorts of way to install apps while bypassing the play store?

I'm guessing it's because this was a jury trial and Apple's wasn't.

So why didn't they go for a jury trial with Apple?

Re: Epic vs. Google: Google Loses

#42

Post by LordKeren » Tue, Dec 12, 2023, 1:01 AM UTC

account-5 wrote: post #13

osti wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But can Epic appeal then against Apple?

Were I Google I'd be appealling on the grounds Apple got away with it.

They tried to use the apple case to get this suit dismissed. The judge already declined to dismiss the Google case

Re: Epic vs. Google: Google Loses

#43

Post by Wowfunhappy » Tue, Dec 12, 2023, 1:01 AM UTC

kulahan wrote: post #23

For anyone curious why Google lost: >Epic v. Google [...] hinged on secret revenue sharing deals between Google, smartphone makers, and big game developers, ones that Google execs internally believed were designed to keep rival app stores down. Without finding the same thing in Apple, I doubt this will affect Apple's case much, but of course I should mention I'm not a lawyer; I'm perfectly happy to be schooled if som…

Apple doesn't need to strike secret deals to keep out alternative app stores because they've made alternate app stores completely impossible.

If the result of this case is "you can have a monopoly as long as your device and ecosystem are 100% locked down", that's terrible!

Re: Epic vs. Google: Google Loses

#44

Post by superb_dev » Tue, Dec 12, 2023, 1:01 AM UTC

lucasyvas wrote: post #15

So they will take this back to Apple and probably win then? To me this means Epic has unilaterally won. Android was the more open of the two. We all know from the personal computer how it should be. Apple and Google are on borrowed time.

Google did engage in anticompetitive behavior to make their App Store dominant over other third party App Stores

Re: Epic vs. Google: Google Loses

#45

Post by yladiz » Tue, Dec 12, 2023, 1:01 AM UTC

jonny_eh wrote: post #10

neverrroot wrote: post #6

A starting point, Apple should be next.

Epic lost to Apple, including on appeal. This will likely be decided by the Supreme Court.

Hmm, what do you mean it will likely be decided by the Supreme Court? The difference between this and the Apple case?

Re: Epic vs. Google: Google Loses

#46

Post by mikhailt » Tue, Dec 12, 2023, 1:02 AM UTC

lucasyvas wrote: post #15

So they will take this back to Apple and probably win then? To me this means Epic has unilaterally won. Android was the more open of the two. We all know from the personal computer how it should be. Apple and Google are on borrowed time.

Not likely, they aren’t the same type of case.

Apple didn’t force anyone else to install their App Store. That’s where Google differs and what Epic proved they did. They can’t prove Apple did anything like that since Apple doesn’t offer iOS to anyone else.

Re: Epic vs. Google: Google Loses

#47

Post by kevindamm » Tue, Dec 12, 2023, 1:02 AM UTC

account-5 wrote: post #13

osti wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But can Epic appeal then against Apple?

Were I Google I'd be appealling on the grounds Apple got away with it.

Did Apple pay companies not to deploy their own app stores? Oh, right, they were restrictive about even an app that had the same functionality as an Apple-made app, let alone competing app stores. This might get interesting.

Re: Epic vs. Google: Google Loses

#48

Post by fbdab103 » Tue, Dec 12, 2023, 1:02 AM UTC

wnevets wrote: post #8

Didn't Apple effectively win their lawsuit while having an actual monopoly on iPhone app installs? Can someone explain why Google lost despite android having all sorts of way to install apps while bypassing the play store?

I thought this was the case where Google execs deliberately went off the record to avoid having their chats recorded for discovery. Hiding documents during a legal hold does not make the justice system happy. Unless I am confusing trials, this article[0] goes into more detail.

[0] https://www.cnn.com/2023/03/29/tech/judge-google-deleted-cha...

Re: Epic vs. Google: Google Loses

#49

Post by bilekas » Tue, Dec 12, 2023, 1:03 AM UTC

rsweeney21 wrote: post #27

This is huge! I've had so many business ideas that I've killed at the idea stage because giving 30% of revenue to Apple or Google made it not viable. Might be time to revisit them...

This seems a great excuse to blame Instead of procrastination to me.. So 70% revenue was not enough to get something off the ground?

Re: Epic vs. Google: Google Loses

#50

Post by reilly3000 » Tue, Dec 12, 2023, 1:03 AM UTC

Assuming this ruling stands, and the pattern is extended to Apple as well, what does a multi-app-store world look like? How does one "install" a new app store, what sort of permissions does it get? Who can start a new app store? What risks does a user accept when they do business with a 3rd party store?

I for one would welcome a mobile store from Valve, Epic etc, especially if I could have my purchases work on multiple mobile platforms.