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23andMe confirms hackers stole ancestry data on 6.9M users

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Re: 23andMe confirms hackers stole ancestry data on 6.9M users

#311

Post by tptacek »

jstarfish wrote: post #209
bigtunacan wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Considering one of the hacker's first actions was to offer for sale data identifying people of Jewish or Chinese descent I think that's a very valid concern.

Did anybody actually buy it though? This could be misdirection, or just misguided marketing based on historical instances of abuse. China isn't known for trying to repatriate descendants, and it's not exactly difficult to find Jews. Ancestry data would certainly be of interest to a particular demographic known to discriminate by caste. There's no escaping your low-class heritage when anyone can look up your stolen DN…

I have no idea what "it's not exactly difficult to find Jews" means. It struck me as kind of an icky thing to say, so you might want to clarify the benign intent you had for saying it.

Re: 23andMe confirms hackers stole ancestry data on 6.9M users

#312

Post by WendyTheWillow »

illiac786 wrote: post #309
WendyTheWillow wrote: post #307

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, we definitely waited for pedestrians to be hit before deciding road speeds need to be regulated. We waited until long after many pedestrians were struck by vehicles before even considering solutions. And I can't believe I have to say this, but someone dying by getting hit by a car is more serious than someone's SSN getting leaked. If this is such a big issue, why hasn't more happened already? Why don't we see ma…

> DNA leak DNA was not leaked. ancestry only. >someone dying by getting hit by a car is more serious than someone's SSN getting leaked. yes, I don't see why the analogy is not valid anymore though. Analogy was about preemption, not gravity of the issue. >If that's such a big issue, why hasn't more happened already? Don't know, but we are running circles, my point is, we shouldn't wait for more to happen. I thought yo…

I don't get that, because we wait for people to do crimes before we punish them.

Re: 23andMe confirms hackers stole ancestry data on 6.9M users

#313

Post by illiac786 »

WendyTheWillow wrote: post #312
illiac786 wrote: post #309

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> DNA leak DNA was not leaked. ancestry only. >someone dying by getting hit by a car is more serious than someone's SSN getting leaked. yes, I don't see why the analogy is not valid anymore though. Analogy was about preemption, not gravity of the issue. >If that's such a big issue, why hasn't more happened already? Don't know, but we are running circles, my point is, we shouldn't wait for more to happen. I thought yo…

I don't get that, because we wait for people to do crimes before we punish them.

again, I'm not talking about arrest or punishment.

I'm talking about prevention. Like "don't walk at night in this area alone".

Re: 23andMe confirms hackers stole ancestry data on 6.9M users

#314

Post by helsinkiandrew »

taurath wrote: post #29

How much does that have to do with their TOS update which went out on thanksgiving DAY (the most perfect time to get lost in everyone’s inboxes). The TOS update somehow tries to forbid class actions, requires you to go through an “informal” 60 day process before any legal action, and forces you into binding arbitration. Functionally you as a customer have next to no legal rights, according to 23andMe lawyers who cook…

If 6.9M users were to start arbitration proceedings - 23andMe might prefer a class action lawsuit.

Re: 23andMe confirms hackers stole ancestry data on 6.9M users

#315

Post by m_eiman »

kjkjadksj wrote: post #288
m_eiman wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People bent on doing evil things are going to do evil things, but perhaps it's a good idea to not build systems that will let their evil be faster and more efficient.

I have yet to see how this allows them to move faster and be more efficient. People have this fear of some orwellian government killing or imprisoning with little regard for ethics or due process except they will stop all of that for careful analysis of DNA. Seems bizarre to me. Either you are getting screwed or you aren’t but this stuff makes no screwing possible that wasn’t already.

"careful analysis of DNA"

No need for careful analysis, just force the company to give you a list of registered users matching some criteria. Your kill list is just a SQL query away.

"makes no screwing possible that wasn’t already"

Sure, but it makes it easier and faster to select targets for your screwing.

Re: 23andMe confirms hackers stole ancestry data on 6.9M users

#317

Post by kjkjadksj »

m_eiman wrote: post #315
kjkjadksj wrote: post #288

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have yet to see how this allows them to move faster and be more efficient. People have this fear of some orwellian government killing or imprisoning with little regard for ethics or due process except they will stop all of that for careful analysis of DNA. Seems bizarre to me. Either you are getting screwed or you aren’t but this stuff makes no screwing possible that wasn’t already.

"careful analysis of DNA" No need for careful analysis, just force the company to give you a list of registered users matching some criteria. Your kill list is just a SQL query away. "makes no screwing possible that wasn’t already" Sure, but it makes it easier and faster to select targets for your screwing.

Historically the people doing the screwing weren’t so concerned about precision. Imprecision lets you throw in political enemies who don’t fit the demographic you are directly targeting so its quite useful

Re: 23andMe confirms hackers stole ancestry data on 6.9M users

#318

Post by kjkjadksj »

Buttons840 wrote: post #308
kjkjadksj wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its illegal to discriminate on terms like this though. Replace the word gene with demography and you can see why.

It's illegal now , but maybe not forever. Plus, illegal things still happen. Or, maybe more likely than discriminating based on demography, what if certain "Obamacare" provisions are repealed and insurance companies are allowed to adjust prices based on genes, including the genes of relatives. It's all a little far fetch, but only a little. My point is privacy is important and even those "with nothing to hide" might…

They can already do that without dna though. They can just deny coverage on preexising conditions. This is what I am getting at. All the harms people cite with dna data are usually predicated on some dystopian government emerging, but also you can perform those same exact harms if you wanted without the dna data. In essense the dna data is not enabling anything not already possible for bad actors.

Re: 23andMe confirms hackers stole ancestry data on 6.9M users

#319

Post by WendyTheWillow »

illiac786 wrote: post #313
WendyTheWillow wrote: post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't get that, because we wait for people to do crimes before we punish them.

again, I'm not talking about arrest or punishment. I'm talking about prevention. Like "don't walk at night in this area alone".

That rule is as a result of bad things happening while walking alone at night.

I know what you’re talking about, I just don’t think you realize how such things become rules. We very rarely, if ever, create preventative rules, and when we do the rules are terrible because we don’t know the issue well enough.

Re: 23andMe confirms hackers stole ancestry data on 6.9M users

#320

Post by kjkjadksj »

zlg_codes wrote: post #293
kjkjadksj wrote: post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the government wanted you gone there wouldn’t be this song and dance about getting dna data from a blood bank. They’d just kill you and that would be that.

They can barely agree on a budget. They wouldn't be able to unify against the public, they're too dysfunctional. You'd need a President willing to defy his oath and two other branches on board with him. Not happening.

Congress is not the agency that does the killing. More efficient ones with practically zero oversight do. See Frank Olson for an example, we only know about that after mkultra was revealed in CIA abuse investigations. His family still is fighting for justice some 60 years after his assassination.
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