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Swedish Tesla strike goes international as Norwegian and Danish unions join in

theregister.com

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Re: Swedish Tesla strike goes international as Norwegian and Danish unions join in

#231

Post by justinclift »

redandblack wrote: post #88
eckesicle wrote: post #25

> Postal workers even decided not to deliver mail to the electric automaker, including license plates – an action that Musk called "insane". The local court has since put a stop to that action. This is no longer true. A higher court overturned that decision and the license plates are again blocked from reaching Tesla.

I hope Elon gets the license plates delivered by courier, which really cannot be that expensive. Then the unions have to figure out their next steps. Get your popcorn

Wonder if the available couriers are all in the same union though? :)

Re: Swedish Tesla strike goes international as Norwegian and Danish unions join in

#232

Post by lawn »

carlosjobim wrote: post #204
sampo wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If union membership is really the way of life in Sweden, is there anything preventing the government from a legislative solution? Nordic countries actually have relatively weak labour laws. What might be handled in legislation in US (e.g. minimum wage), is handled in collective bargaining agreements, that are negotiated between trade unions and employers' associations. And the trade unions and the employers' associ…

It's a very sweet deal for the unions and for large employers. The unions make sure to collectively "bargain" each year for extremely low pay raises and even for nominal pay cuts for their members. In exchange the large employers force every employee to sign up for union membership. Sometimes the company itself signs the employee to the union, without any consent from the individual. In exchange the unions get to col…

> In exchange the large employers force every employee to sign up for union membership. Sometimes the company itself signs the employee to the union, without any consent from the individual.

This is not the case in Sweden.

Maybe in the US?

Re: Swedish Tesla strike goes international as Norwegian and Danish unions join in

#233

Post by yxhuvud »

robertlagrant wrote: post #98
bayindirh wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Doesn’t matter. Even when you’re fully owned by a government, unionization allows you to do this. This is what unionization is, protects the worker regardless of your employer.

Unionization shouldn't be there to disrupt another company. It should be there so you can bargain against your employer. This seems really inappropriate.

The problem is exactly that Tesla refuses to bargain with the union. Once you are dealing with the unions you will be safe from sympathetic strikes.

Re: Swedish Tesla strike goes international as Norwegian and Danish unions join in

#234

Post by 6565657 »

wharvle wrote: post #146
throwawa14223 wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would you abridge my freedom of association by forcing me to be part of a group I have no desire to join?

You’re exactly as forced as people are forced to have a job.

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Re: Swedish Tesla strike goes international as Norwegian and Danish unions join in

#235

Post by ExoticPearTree »

Hikikomori wrote: post #55
gottorf wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's wild! As a (pseudo-) government agency, it seems like the postal service shouldn't be legally allowed to pick and choose whose mail to deliver and whose to withhold.

They're not allowed to pick and choose themselves. Why and when you can strike and sympathy strike is clearly defined, if you take action outside this framework it would be an illegal strike. And just to add, the postal service in question is private and works like a private company, though the states of Sweden and Denmark fully owns it. Employees are not state employees.

> And just to add, the postal service in question is private and works like a private company, though the states of Sweden and Denmark fully owns it. Employees are not state employees.

I don't think you understand how a private company works. You can't say it is a private company owned by the state - if that is the case, it is a public government agency, no matter how you want it not to be. So in short, a government agency chooses if it wants to work or not...

Re: Swedish Tesla strike goes international as Norwegian and Danish unions join in

#236

Post by legitster »

sampo wrote: post #92
legitster wrote: post #31

I'm coming from a US perspective and trying to understand what is actually happening https://www.ifmetall.se/aktuellt/tesla/ Does IF Metall already represent all of Tesla's employees? Does that mean there are no active Tesla services in Sweden during the strike? If union membership is really the way of life in Sweden, is there anything preventing the government from a legislative solution? Just mandate collective agr…

> If union membership is really the way of life in Sweden, is there anything preventing the government from a legislative solution? Nordic countries actually have relatively weak labour laws. What might be handled in legislation in US (e.g. minimum wage), is handled in collective bargaining agreements, that are negotiated between trade unions and employers' associations. And the trade unions and the employers' associ…

> And the trade unions and the employers' associations like it this way, that the power is in their hands, and not in legislation. A government that would try to step on their turf, would be asking for a lot of trouble.

Part of the reason the US has so many onerous labor laws is not necessarily from anti-labor sentiment (though it didn't hurt), but part of anti-crime efforts to fight the mafia in the 50s and 60s.

"Sign this agreement with the Teamsters, or else your parts will sit at the dock and your customer deliveries will sit in a warehouse" was a very real and common tactic. So the US passed a bunch of laws against sympathy strikes.

Obviously the mafia is no longer a bit issue in the economy, but the laws are still on the books, and people in the US still feel uneasy about general strikes.

Re: Swedish Tesla strike goes international as Norwegian and Danish unions join in

#237

Post by robertlagrant »

bayindirh wrote: post #160
robertlagrant wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it's not a sympathetic strike. They're refusing to deliver Tesla's mail. They aren't striking against their employer.

They are increasing the pressure on a company which is not treating their workers well and fairly. These workers are friends, wives, husbands, relatives… It’s more than justified.

You're missing the point. I'm not debating the validity of whether people should leave Tesla and go work somewhere else. I'm saying that it's not a strike if you're just refusing service to a customer.

A strike - whether because of your circumstances or another's - is you downing tools and stopping working.

Re: Swedish Tesla strike goes international as Norwegian and Danish unions join in

#238

Post by pompino »

eddtries wrote: post #194
mxsjoberg wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Maybe Tesla is the problem here. No, this is an issue for other smaller companies too (with less media coverage) > Maybe the rest of the world needs to catch up to the societal norms of Sweden when it comes to worker's rights. I hope not. I kind of want a flying car ASAP. Not never.

Hell yeah! Let's get those lazy workers on the lines working harder. Innovation and growth at all costs. Workers are cogs and if they're not behaving correctly they should be fixed or replaced. I, personally, am happy with a 21% illiteracy rate in America - workers don't need to be literate to make my flying cars faster. Sweden might rank top for happiness and health but that's not going to make my bank numbers get h…

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Re: Swedish Tesla strike goes international as Norwegian and Danish unions join in

#239

Post by carlosjobim »

lawn wrote: post #232
carlosjobim wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a very sweet deal for the unions and for large employers. The unions make sure to collectively "bargain" each year for extremely low pay raises and even for nominal pay cuts for their members. In exchange the large employers force every employee to sign up for union membership. Sometimes the company itself signs the employee to the union, without any consent from the individual. In exchange the unions get to col…

> In exchange the large employers force every employee to sign up for union membership. Sometimes the company itself signs the employee to the union, without any consent from the individual. This is not the case in Sweden. Maybe in the US?

I know for a matter of fact that it is the case in Sweden with some employers. They'll sign you up for the union without your consent and without informing you. Then the union in their turn will sign you up with insurance companies and other third parties without consent of information. Just a bill suddenly arriving in your mail that you have to pay.

Re: Swedish Tesla strike goes international as Norwegian and Danish unions join in

#240

Post by 6565657 »

s0l1dsnak3123 wrote: post #121

Maybe - just maybe - Tesla should just give in instead of destroying their brand in the Nordics, which is what they are doing. The workers are in charge, and they are also the ones buying Teslas (Yes Americans, in Sweden/Denmark/Norway Teslas are affordable enough for normal people who are in unions because they are paid correctly). Maybe it's a good idea not to destroy your entire market while also destroying the me…

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