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There's an uptick in Amazon employees quitting

businessinsider.com

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Re: There's an uptick in Amazon employees quitting

#11

Post by ActorNightly »

lopis wrote: post #4
ActorNightly wrote: post #2

Planned all along. Many roles were hired as remote, with then requiring people to relocate for RTO. Easiest way to downsize. The real reason for RTO is of course tax benefits that Amazon gets from local/state governments only if there are buts in seats in the office buildings (since people coming into the office means they are in the area which means that they spend money in local restaurants/shops, e.t.c)

One think I've always wondered about RTO measures is, can they force you to choose bewteen RTO or resign? Or to they have to fire you (and with that entitle you to whatever compensation you deserve)?

They fire you, with a very valid reason of not being in the office, which from a legal perspective is very hard to argue against on the employee side.

Re: There's an uptick in Amazon employees quitting

#12

Post by ITB »

bob67 wrote: post #5
lopis wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One think I've always wondered about RTO measures is, can they force you to choose bewteen RTO or resign? Or to they have to fire you (and with that entitle you to whatever compensation you deserve)?

How do you force someone to resign?

Either they start coming to the office or their employment will be terminated. It’s not a resignation.

Re: There's an uptick in Amazon employees quitting

#13

Post by toomuchtodo »

ActorNightly wrote: post #2

Planned all along. Many roles were hired as remote, with then requiring people to relocate for RTO. Easiest way to downsize. The real reason for RTO is of course tax benefits that Amazon gets from local/state governments only if there are buts in seats in the office buildings (since people coming into the office means they are in the area which means that they spend money in local restaurants/shops, e.t.c)

> The real reason for RTO is of course tax benefits that Amazon gets from local/state governments only if there are buts in seats in the office buildings (since people coming into the office means they are in the area which means that they spend money in local restaurants/shops, e.t.c)

Are these tax breaks enumerated and tracked somewhere? What departments would be appropriate to receive FOIA requests on the matter?

Re: There's an uptick in Amazon employees quitting

#14

Post by ITB »

BetaDeltaAlpha wrote: post #7
lopis wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One think I've always wondered about RTO measures is, can they force you to choose bewteen RTO or resign? Or to they have to fire you (and with that entitle you to whatever compensation you deserve)?

Are people entitled to severance in the USA? I thought severance packages generally come with some considerations about indemnifying the company and such. Its a deal, not an entitlement. Forcing an employee to resign is a "Constructive Dismissal" and there's plenty of case law around it.

No. There’s mandatory unemployment insurance/tax companies pay that will float employees terminated without cause for a little time, depending on the state. But it’s not high.

Large companies tend to give decent exit packages though.

Re: There's an uptick in Amazon employees quitting

#15

Post by dolni »

ActorNightly wrote: post #11
lopis wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One think I've always wondered about RTO measures is, can they force you to choose bewteen RTO or resign? Or to they have to fire you (and with that entitle you to whatever compensation you deserve)?

They fire you, with a very valid reason of not being in the office, which from a legal perspective is very hard to argue against on the employee side.

Is it very valid if they hired you as a remote employee to start with?

Re: There's an uptick in Amazon employees quitting

#16

Post by pixl97 »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #13
ActorNightly wrote: post #2

Planned all along. Many roles were hired as remote, with then requiring people to relocate for RTO. Easiest way to downsize. The real reason for RTO is of course tax benefits that Amazon gets from local/state governments only if there are buts in seats in the office buildings (since people coming into the office means they are in the area which means that they spend money in local restaurants/shops, e.t.c)

> The real reason for RTO is of course tax benefits that Amazon gets from local/state governments only if there are buts in seats in the office buildings (since people coming into the office means they are in the area which means that they spend money in local restaurants/shops, e.t.c) Are these tax breaks enumerated and tracked somewhere? What departments would be appropriate to receive FOIA requests on the matter?

Honestly a lot of these tax breaks are for local taxes so other than the county/city they are in, other than the local paper and the county courthouse I'm not sure if they have to be anywhere else.

Re: There's an uptick in Amazon employees quitting

#17

Post by toomuchtodo »

pixl97 wrote: post #16
toomuchtodo wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The real reason for RTO is of course tax benefits that Amazon gets from local/state governments only if there are buts in seats in the office buildings (since people coming into the office means they are in the area which means that they spend money in local restaurants/shops, e.t.c) Are these tax breaks enumerated and tracked somewhere? What departments would be appropriate to receive FOIA requests on the matter?

Honestly a lot of these tax breaks are for local taxes so other than the county/city they are in, other than the local paper and the county courthouse I'm not sure if they have to be anywhere else.

I will have a database built. Thank you!

Re: There's an uptick in Amazon employees quitting

#18

Post by FireBeyond »

ActorNightly wrote: post #11
lopis wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One think I've always wondered about RTO measures is, can they force you to choose bewteen RTO or resign? Or to they have to fire you (and with that entitle you to whatever compensation you deserve)?

They fire you, with a very valid reason of not being in the office, which from a legal perspective is very hard to argue against on the employee side.

At least in Washington state, that's a maybe.

RCW 50.20.050 (https://app.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=50.20.050) says you can even quit and get unemployment if among several other items:

> (vii) The claimant's worksite changed, such change caused a material increase in distance or difficulty of travel, and, after the change, the commute was greater than is customary for workers in the claimant's job classification and labor market;

Re: There's an uptick in Amazon employees quitting

#19

Post by susiecambria »

pixl97 wrote: post #16
toomuchtodo wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The real reason for RTO is of course tax benefits that Amazon gets from local/state governments only if there are buts in seats in the office buildings (since people coming into the office means they are in the area which means that they spend money in local restaurants/shops, e.t.c) Are these tax breaks enumerated and tracked somewhere? What departments would be appropriate to receive FOIA requests on the matter?

Honestly a lot of these tax breaks are for local taxes so other than the county/city they are in, other than the local paper and the county courthouse I'm not sure if they have to be anywhere else.

The information may also show up in tax expenditure reports. And/or in legislation.

Re: There's an uptick in Amazon employees quitting

#20

Post by djtango »

bob67 wrote: post #5
lopis wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One think I've always wondered about RTO measures is, can they force you to choose bewteen RTO or resign? Or to they have to fire you (and with that entitle you to whatever compensation you deserve)?

How do you force someone to resign?

I heard that in Japan they will almost never fire someone, for various reasons. So when it's time to go there are stories of peoples desk being moved to the cupboard for example.
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