Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Governments spying on Apple, Google users through push notifications

reuters.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

191–200 of 649 posts

Re: Governments spying on Apple, Google users through push notifications

#191

Post by forward1 »

AndrewKemendo wrote: post #106

This is yet another example of: If the data can be collected it will be used by governments You can slow this down by making data explicitly built to be impossible to read in transit (eg e2e) and then deleting or never saving it, but the fact that data flows through multiple stops means each transition is an opportunity for third party observation This is deterministic and is built into the structure of data producti…

E2E does not solve the problem outlined here: surveillance of metadata at a global panopticon scale.

Re: Governments spying on Apple, Google users through push notifications

#192

Post by wl »

briffle wrote: post #154
calvinmorrison wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

perhaps that democracy is not effective when the state organs are unelected bureacrats with guns

Would you prefer elected bureacrats with guns? That scares me more. Perhaps we just go with rock solid transparency laws...

At least elected bureaucrats are theoretically accountable to the electorate. The gripe comes from things like the unelected bureaucrats at the US Department of Justice deciding that as part of implementing the Americans with Disabilities Act, there are only two limited and inadequate questions you can ask of someone with an apparently bogus service dog or else. That rule didn't come from the people who wrote the law.

Re: Governments spying on Apple, Google users through push notifications

#193

Post by toyg »

ericmay wrote: post #175
toyg wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or to track US activists and resell the information to the US government, in exchange for data on other five-eyes citizens or access to other surveillance systems (US ones are obviously the best, from a military standpoint).

Or (insert country you have a political agenda against) to (do thing you disagree with) for the purposes of (pushing your own political agenda).

More like "or (insert country that shouldn't be doing something according to its own laws) to (do something against its own laws) for the purposes of (someone's profit)".

Re: Governments spying on Apple, Google users through push notifications

#194

Post by criddell »

sonicanatidae wrote: post #124
chatmasta wrote: post #73

This, to me, is the more disturbing part of the article: > In this case, the federal government prohibited us from sharing any information," the company said in a statement. "Now that this method has become public we are updating our transparency reporting to detail these kinds of requests. What is the point of transparency reports if they don't include major vectors of government surveillance? IMO such gag orders sh…

>What is the point of transparency reports if they don't include major vectors of government surveillance? The feels.

It's more than that, IMHO.

I think companies publishing whatever they can is a good thing. We would be worse off if they took the attitude of if we can't publish everything we might as well publish nothing.

Re: Governments spying on Apple, Google users through push notifications

#195

Post by knallfrosch »

FooBarBizBazz wrote: post #151

A paranoid part of me has wondered if some of the text/phone spam we all receive is actually used to stimulate cellphones for tracking purposes. If you have deeper access to the OS, then fingerprint unlock or FaceID also seem important for positive identification prior to, for example, a Predator strike.

I don't think so. I'm German and receive the spam, even though I can be tracked using SMS messages that aren't shown on the display at all.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SMS#Silent_SMS

Plus, you can always ask the carriers to which tower(s) a phone is connected and simply triangulate from there, without sending any (user) data to the phone.

Re: Governments spying on Apple, Google users through push notifications

#196

Post by [deleted] »

forward1 wrote: post #168
g-b-r wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe, but for sure avoiding stock Android and Google apps increases privacy a lot.

Depends on your definition of privacy. Maybe privacy from Google, at the cost of additional scrutiny from domestic intelligence services.

[deleted]

Re: Governments spying on Apple, Google users through push notifications

#198

Post by alfiedotwtf »

cultureswitch wrote: post #84
chatmasta wrote: post #73

This, to me, is the more disturbing part of the article: > In this case, the federal government prohibited us from sharing any information," the company said in a statement. "Now that this method has become public we are updating our transparency reporting to detail these kinds of requests. What is the point of transparency reports if they don't include major vectors of government surveillance? IMO such gag orders sh…

Seems like a pretty open and shut case of unconstitutional restriction of speech in the US. Especially when you consider the wording of the Apple communication saying that they can talk about it openly now that it's public knowledge.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third-party_doctrine

Re: Governments spying on Apple, Google users through push notifications

#199

Post by pc86 »

titzer wrote: post #155
chatmasta wrote: post #73

This, to me, is the more disturbing part of the article: > In this case, the federal government prohibited us from sharing any information," the company said in a statement. "Now that this method has become public we are updating our transparency reporting to detail these kinds of requests. What is the point of transparency reports if they don't include major vectors of government surveillance? IMO such gag orders sh…

> But gagging a company from disclosing untargeted or semi-targeted surveillance, especially if it involves American citizens, seems like it should be unconstitutional on free speech grounds. I see you have not read the Patriot Act, an Orwellian double-speak of a title if there ever was one.

The first "paper" I ever wrote was an anti-USA PATRIOT Act paper for a scholarship competition in 2003 when I was 17 where I was awarded $1,000. Literally the only thing I remember is what the acronym USA PATRIOT stands for.

Uniting and Strengthening American by Providing Appropriate Tools Required to Intercept and Obstruct Terrorism.

It really is one of the best double-speak bill titles ever.

Re: Governments spying on Apple, Google users through push notifications

#200

Post by g-b-r »

forward1 wrote: post #168
g-b-r wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe, but for sure avoiding stock Android and Google apps increases privacy a lot.

Depends on your definition of privacy. Maybe privacy from Google, at the cost of additional scrutiny from domestic intelligence services.

There are few cases where that would be worse than using a normal all-monitoring android
Post reply on HN