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An Open Letter to the Python Software Foundation

pythonafrica.blogspot.com

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Re: An Open Letter to the Python Software Foundation

#81

Post by dappermanneke »

keraf wrote: post #41
ayhanfuat wrote: post #5

> What counts as “safety”? Which places in the world are truly safe for LGBTQIA+ community? How much of a city, or state, or country needs to be LGBTQIA+ hostile for the whole of it to be declared unworthy of PSF support? What a cheap shot. You don't need a safetyometer or something to determine that a country where same sex relationship is punishable by life imprisonment is unsafe for homosexuals or bisexuals.

The claims of Zanzibar being unsafe for LGBTQIA+ communities is ridiculous. I live there and it's the most tolerant place I lived in so far. There are laws, but as long as you mind your own business and don't disturb others, you will be left alone. I've even been to same-sex weddings here (between foreigners of course, same-sex relationships are still taboo between locals but they do exist) and have gay friends livin…

zanzibari gays do not exist? they are not locals in your understanding of the word? glad to hear the rich expat bubble in zanzibar is generally tolerant though! you’re only risking a life sentence as a western gay if you can’t afford to bribe the prosecutor, just like most other third world countries

Re: An Open Letter to the Python Software Foundation

#82

Post by paganel »

Takennickname wrote: post #3

It's a grant, not an entitlement.

So what's the PSF for, then? Looks like supporting the spread of Python the language in geographical spaces like Africa should be at the top of their priorities list, at least by looking at current demographic trends, and not to invest in another boring Python conference held in Nowhere, OH, or in Neinpinkelsburg, Northern Rhenanina.

Re: An Open Letter to the Python Software Foundation

#83

Post by ttyprintk »

darkerside wrote: post #53
ayhanfuat wrote: post #5

> What counts as “safety”? Which places in the world are truly safe for LGBTQIA+ community? How much of a city, or state, or country needs to be LGBTQIA+ hostile for the whole of it to be declared unworthy of PSF support? What a cheap shot. You don't need a safetyometer or something to determine that a country where same sex relationship is punishable by life imprisonment is unsafe for homosexuals or bisexuals.

Some people might be shocked that you can be incarcerated in the US for putting substances in your own body.

[flagged]

Re: An Open Letter to the Python Software Foundation

#84

Post by konschubert »

keraf wrote: post #41
ayhanfuat wrote: post #5

> What counts as “safety”? Which places in the world are truly safe for LGBTQIA+ community? How much of a city, or state, or country needs to be LGBTQIA+ hostile for the whole of it to be declared unworthy of PSF support? What a cheap shot. You don't need a safetyometer or something to determine that a country where same sex relationship is punishable by life imprisonment is unsafe for homosexuals or bisexuals.

The claims of Zanzibar being unsafe for LGBTQIA+ communities is ridiculous. I live there and it's the most tolerant place I lived in so far. There are laws, but as long as you mind your own business and don't disturb others, you will be left alone. I've even been to same-sex weddings here (between foreigners of course, same-sex relationships are still taboo between locals but they do exist) and have gay friends livin…

“There are laws, but as long…”

Cool. So you live at the whims of a bunch of corrupt officials and police, who can decide if you should be imprisoned or not.

That’s not the same as being free.

Re: An Open Letter to the Python Software Foundation

#85

Post by mdew »

Xeamek wrote: post #29
anonylizard wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

You don't need LGBT hunt squads. All you need is the fact that a gay couple holding hands or kissing publicly is unsafe. "Then just don't kiss publicly". Sure, hiding one's sexuality isn't that hard, especially for a short period of time. But that's the whole problem: they shouldn't have to hide it in the first place. Home people might know you, but in home country you are against only bigoted individuals, not the en…

[dead]

Re: An Open Letter to the Python Software Foundation

#86

Post by Ralfp »

0xDEAFBEAD wrote: post #77
Ralfp wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Political pluralism is nice when you are discussing things like tax levels or investment targets, but a lot of "us vs them" arises from discussions like "I just want to exist in the open without prosecution" vs "your very existence is a problem and needs to be prevented".

I would argue that one of the most effective steps you can take in a situation like that is to establish pluralistic institutions where people get to know each other in person, as fellow human beings.

What does this change? 100 years ago people were writing angry letters to the American newspapers about women suffrage being an obvious sign of mental disease spreading in the society. You think people writing those letters were isolated from women and didn't know them?

Re: An Open Letter to the Python Software Foundation

#87

Post by rob74 »

red_admiral wrote: post #76
keraf wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The claims of Zanzibar being unsafe for LGBTQIA+ communities is ridiculous. I live there and it's the most tolerant place I lived in so far. There are laws, but as long as you mind your own business and don't disturb others, you will be left alone. I've even been to same-sex weddings here (between foreigners of course, same-sex relationships are still taboo between locals but they do exist) and have gay friends livin…

There are various indexes of how LGBT+ friendly countries are. For example, equaldex lists Tanzania as rank 181 out of 197 countries (lower is better), with a total score of 12/100 (higher is better, best is Iceland at 92-100). They list their methodology and how their scores are computed, so if you want to present a factual counter-argument you are welcome to (I'm not an expert on the matter). But it seems to me tha…

Never been to Tanzania or Zanzibar, but I would assume that Zanzibar, being dependent on tourism, is more tolerant. Still, if I were gay and that would be punishable with life imprisonment in a country, I would avoid it...

Re: An Open Letter to the Python Software Foundation

#89

Post by Xeamek »

lynx23 wrote: post #65
Xeamek wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>software should not be tied to politics. Why not? I mean, software is a product like any other. I for example wouldn't like if a group like ISIS was using my software, especially if they were using it to actively help them in commiting their crimes. If I could prevent that from happening, why shouldn't I?

The DSFG is a nice counter-example to your claim. Either something is unconditionally free, or it simply isn't.

>either something is unconditionally free, or it simply isn't.

Ok, it isn't. So what?

Re: An Open Letter to the Python Software Foundation

#90

Post by FpUser »

Xeamek wrote: post #28
mmtml wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the point was not properly made on their behalf. That said, do the organizers of the conference have any saying on the politics on their country and actually deserve to be punished because of them? I don't really think so.

That's literally how any 'anti-state' action works, ever. Does an individual Russian have a say in what Putin does in Ukraine? Probably not. But countries are a collection of its citizens. The only way to 'punish' a country is to punish its citizens. Sometimes it's more direct, other times less. But at the end of the day, any and all actions will trickle down to punishing individuals, because that's simply how action…

>"The only way to 'punish' a country is to punish its citizens."

And the rulers of said country do not give a flying fuck about it. They're also protected from the revolt as they have police / army in their pocket to deal with the people.

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