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My Fediverse use – I'm hosting everything myself – PeerTube, Mastodon and Lemmy

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Re: My Fediverse use – I'm hosting everything myself – PeerTube, Mastodon and Lemmy

#101

Post by WolfeReader »

apitman wrote: post #97

One huge shortcoming of the Fediverse as currently implemented is that you have to use a different ID for each app, ie tube.jeena.net/@jeena, toot.jeena.net/@jeena, etc. What if you want to use the Mastodon UI to write a comment on a video? Your comment is going to use a different ID than the one you normally use to interact with videos. Given this, what's the point of federating these different apps with each other?…

In practice, federation works _great_ when the apps all have the same basic structure, and gets pretty rough otherwise.

Mastodon instances basically _work great_ with each other, and with Friendica and Calckey too, since they have the same Twitter-like structure. Lemmy and Kbin - and all instances thereof - can chat with each other without issue too, since they have the communities + threads structure in common.

But trying to get Mastodon and Lemmy to talk to each other is 1. surprisingly possible, and 2. kind of annoying, since they speak the same protocol but have different structures of communication. And never mind other ActivityPub applications like BookWyrm or WriteFreely or PeerTube.

Re: My Fediverse use – I'm hosting everything myself – PeerTube, Mastodon and Lemmy

#102

Post by apitman »

Workaccount2 wrote: post #99
apitman wrote: post #97

One huge shortcoming of the Fediverse as currently implemented is that you have to use a different ID for each app, ie tube.jeena.net/@jeena, toot.jeena.net/@jeena, etc. What if you want to use the Mastodon UI to write a comment on a video? Your comment is going to use a different ID than the one you normally use to interact with videos. Given this, what's the point of federating these different apps with each other?…

A blockchain might actually be a decent solution for this. Just make it so the tokens don't have value.

If all your target users are comfortable with the tradeoffs of systems built on blockchains (ie private key is the source of authority), you're probably looking for Nostr.

Re: My Fediverse use – I'm hosting everything myself – PeerTube, Mastodon and Lemmy

#103

Post by apitman »

kuchenbecker wrote: post #100
apitman wrote: post #97

One huge shortcoming of the Fediverse as currently implemented is that you have to use a different ID for each app, ie tube.jeena.net/@jeena, toot.jeena.net/@jeena, etc. What if you want to use the Mastodon UI to write a comment on a video? Your comment is going to use a different ID than the one you normally use to interact with videos. Given this, what's the point of federating these different apps with each other?…

I don't know enough about the Fediverse, but are those pluggable? I could see having a trusted third party for Identity management.

Why have a third party rather than choosing one of your apps to be the "primary"?

Re: My Fediverse use – I'm hosting everything myself – PeerTube, Mastodon and Lemmy

#104

Post by jdofaz »

kstrauser wrote: post #86
dingnuts wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, but it's email without spam protections of any kind. I ran a homeserver for a little while and didn't want to store the kind of content that came flowing in through the federation endpoints from the moment I interacted with another server. I'm not sure exactly how Mastodon/Pleroma crawl remote homeservers once they're discovered, but I saw a lot of objectionable content on the "Known Network" view from users I…

That's not the default behavior. Mastodon has 3 built-in timelines: - Your "home" TL with people you follow, and the stuff they post/repost/etc. - The "local" TL with the users on your server. - The "federated" TL that's the union of all the people that users on your server follow. Like if you and I are the only 2 people on that instance, and you follow {A, B, C}, and I follow {B, C, D}, then the federated TL will ha…

One issue I've run into with unexpected NSFW in my federated TL on a single user instance is when people I follow reply to an unfollowed account's NSFW post, when the reply gets sent to my server it fetches the parent post

Re: My Fediverse use – I'm hosting everything myself – PeerTube, Mastodon and Lemmy

#105

Post by apitman »

WolfeReader wrote: post #101
apitman wrote: post #97

One huge shortcoming of the Fediverse as currently implemented is that you have to use a different ID for each app, ie tube.jeena.net/@jeena, toot.jeena.net/@jeena, etc. What if you want to use the Mastodon UI to write a comment on a video? Your comment is going to use a different ID than the one you normally use to interact with videos. Given this, what's the point of federating these different apps with each other?…

In practice, federation works _great_ when the apps all have the same basic structure, and gets pretty rough otherwise. Mastodon instances basically _work great_ with each other, and with Friendica and Calckey too, since they have the same Twitter-like structure. Lemmy and Kbin - and all instances thereof - can chat with each other without issue too, since they have the communities + threads structure in common. But…

Do they really need to work that differently though? It seems to me that almost all of them can be represented as trees of text entries. Blog+comments, HN/reddit threads, Stackoverflow QAs, DMs, Discord/Slack, forums. These are all just text trees with optional attachments and/or links to other content (images and videos etc). Why not build that tree structure into the protocol (all you need is 1 parent and 0+ children for each entry)?

Re: My Fediverse use – I'm hosting everything myself – PeerTube, Mastodon and Lemmy

#106

Post by WolfeReader »

apitman wrote: post #105
WolfeReader wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In practice, federation works _great_ when the apps all have the same basic structure, and gets pretty rough otherwise. Mastodon instances basically _work great_ with each other, and with Friendica and Calckey too, since they have the same Twitter-like structure. Lemmy and Kbin - and all instances thereof - can chat with each other without issue too, since they have the communities + threads structure in common. But…

Do they really need to work that differently though? It seems to me that almost all of them can be represented as trees of text entries. Blog+comments, HN/reddit threads, Stackoverflow QAs, DMs, Discord/Slack, forums. These are all just text trees with optional attachments and/or links to other content (images and videos etc). Why not build that tree structure into the protocol (all you need is 1 parent and 0+ childr…

(Using Lemmy+Mastodon as an example)

Lemmy has the concept of "communities" - subreddits, basically. On Mastodon, you can follow a Lemmy user and see their posts+comments exactly as you'd expect. And you can follow a community too! To Mastodon's point of view, the community is a single user that "boosts" (re-tweets) every post and every comment made within. So following a moderately active community from Mastodon will absolutely flood your feed with 100% of the community's user activity.

Meanwhile, Lemmy doesn't do direct messages or use hashtags as a first-class feature. So if a Mastodon user tries to DM a Lemmy user, or a Lemmy user wants to follow a hashtag, they're out of luck.

And again, there are other Fediverse apps with even different models than these. Gitea, Forgejo, and GitLab are going to adapt ActivityPub to all federate with each other - this is a huge win, of course - but would we expect someone to make or review a pull request from their BookWyrm account?

Re: My Fediverse use – I'm hosting everything myself – PeerTube, Mastodon and Lemmy

#107

Post by Feathercrown »

kome wrote: post #70

I've tried various Fediverse services such as Mastodon and Lemmy, and, based on my experience, I've noticed a stronger tendency towards censorship, self-censorship, and ingroup behavior. In comparison, platforms like Twitter and Reddit still feel freer. But overall, the best solution is to use your own website for everything. But too much censure really stifles social media.

> the best solution is to use your own website for everything

You can host your own fediverse services and won't have to worry about being censored

Re: My Fediverse use – I'm hosting everything myself – PeerTube, Mastodon and Lemmy

#109

Post by ertian »

kstrauser wrote: post #87
kome wrote: post #70

I've tried various Fediverse services such as Mastodon and Lemmy, and, based on my experience, I've noticed a stronger tendency towards censorship, self-censorship, and ingroup behavior. In comparison, platforms like Twitter and Reddit still feel freer. But overall, the best solution is to use your own website for everything. But too much censure really stifles social media.

Instead of "censorship", I'd say "moderation". To pick a random example, suppose you're on an instance run by, and dedicated to, right-wing politics. It may block connections from servers meant for and run by devout communists. The reverse would probably also be true. No one's saying fascists or communists can't run their own server. They're saying "I don't want to hear this stuff". It's legal to be an anti-Semite, b…

This is true, but it does reinforce and cement in- and out-group dynamics. You're more likely to be exposed to unfamiliar ideas on a place like Reddit, specifically because you don't _have_ to pick an explicit bubble. When picking a Lemmy instance, you kinda end up aligning yourself with some worldview, and letting some set of strangers curate your environment for you.

Incidentally, that's sort of the weirdest part of signing up for Lemmy. I can't be the only one who got to the "Pick an instance!" step and got kinda paralyzed. I'm a programmer, should I sign up to a programmer-centric instance? But I also have hobbies, political views, favorite forms & genres of media... Should those take priority? And by picking one of them, what curation or censorship am I going to be subject to?

I appreciate the fact that Lemmy isn't under the thumb of one monolith, and that I can bounce from once instance to another if the first isn't working out. But I also like the 'big-tent' feeling of Reddit, where I can sub to all kinds of subreddits, even if the two groups don't get along at all.

Re: My Fediverse use – I'm hosting everything myself – PeerTube, Mastodon and Lemmy

#110

Post by ragebol »

tiberius_p wrote: post #66

Is there a way to have like a backup cloud solution in case my electricity goes down at home and my self hosted server shuts down? Some cloud service that does nothing most of the time except backing up data from the self hosted server from time to time and monitoring if it's up and connected to the internet, and if it's not then it takes over and offers the same service.

How often does your power cut out unexpectedly and how bad is that for you and your website?

For me in the Netherlands, maybe 2 years ago my power cut out for an hour IIRC. Pretty reliable, good enough for my website to be just as available.

Point being: is it worth the effort to have a backup in that circumstance?

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