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AI and Mass Spying

schneier.com

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Re: AI and Mass Spying

#91

Post by bonyt »

JCharante wrote: post #86
bonyt wrote: post #42

I think another aspect of this is mass criminal law enforcement enabled by AI. Many of our criminal laws are written with the implicit assumption that it takes resources to investigate and prosecute a crime, and that this will limit the effective scope of the law. Prosecutorial discretion. Putting aside for the moment the (very serious) injustice that comes with the inequitable use of prosecutorial discretion, let's…

I don't think it'd be chaos. I think the laws would be adjusted.

This is fair. I just wonder if we're about getting to the point where we should be talking about how they would be adjusted.

Re: AI and Mass Spying

#92

Post by okasaki »

namaria wrote: post #82
otteromkram wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it increases ticket issuance for passenger vehicle noise violations (eg - "sport" exhausts, booming stereo system, motorcycles), I'm down.

"If it hurts people I hate I accept" - Every endorsement of authoritarian rule ever

Effectively enforcing laws we agreed to is hardly authoritarian.

Re: AI and Mass Spying

#93

Post by whamlastxmas »

lp0_on_fire wrote: post #68
yonaguska wrote: post #17

It's already happening. See this DHS memo issues on August 8th - page 3. https://www.dhs.gov/sites/default/files/2023-09/23_0913_mgmt... Fortunately the DHS has put together an expert team of non-partisan, honest, Americans to spearhead the effort to protect our democracy. Thank you James Clapper and John Brennan- for stepping up to the task. https://www.dhs.gov/news/2023/09/19/secretary-mayorkas-annou... And just in…

That James Clapper and John Brennan continue to be lauded by the media and their sycophants in government is one of the most disappointing things to happen in my lifetime. Both should be frog marched straight to prison along with their enablers.

Everything the media does is disappointing. It’s all wildly dishonest and damaging and done at the direction of a few billionaires.

Re: AI and Mass Spying

#94

Post by kafrofrite »

bonyt wrote: post #42

I think another aspect of this is mass criminal law enforcement enabled by AI. Many of our criminal laws are written with the implicit assumption that it takes resources to investigate and prosecute a crime, and that this will limit the effective scope of the law. Prosecutorial discretion. Putting aside for the moment the (very serious) injustice that comes with the inequitable use of prosecutorial discretion, let's…

IIRC, in [1] it mentioned a few examples of AI that exhibited the same bias that is currently present in the judicial system, banks etc.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weapons_of_Math_Destruction

Re: AI and Mass Spying

#95

Post by landemva »

somenameforme wrote: post #58

This is a political problem, not a technological one. The USSR (alongside Germany and others) managed effective at scale spying with primitive technology: paperwork for everything and every movement, informants, audio surveillance, and so on. The reason such things did not come to places like the US in the same way is not because we were incapable of such, but because there was no political interest in it. And when o…

In a democracy we would have a chance to vote on individual issues such as data privacy, or war against whomever. USA is a federal republic.

Re: AI and Mass Spying

#96

Post by matthewdgreen »

wahnfrieden wrote: post #85
klik99 wrote: post #72

I don't know why this isn't being discussed more. The reality of the surveillance state is that the sheer amount of data couldn't realistically be monitored - AI very directly solves this problem by summarizing complex data. This, IMO, is the real danger of AI, at least in the short term - not a planet of paperclips, not a moral misalignment, not a media landscape bereft of creativity - but rather a tool for targetin…

People are building that alongside/within this community, eg at Palantir, for many years now YC CEO is also ex Palantir, early employee. Another YC partner backs other invasive police surveillance tech currently. They love this stuff financially and politically.

What's different this time around is that there are multiple democratic governments pushing to block end-to-end encryption technologies, and specifically to insert AI models that will read private messages. Initially these will only be designed to search for heinous content, but the precedent is pretty worrying.

Re: AI and Mass Spying

#97

Post by jodrellblank »

bonyt wrote: post #42

I think another aspect of this is mass criminal law enforcement enabled by AI. Many of our criminal laws are written with the implicit assumption that it takes resources to investigate and prosecute a crime, and that this will limit the effective scope of the law. Prosecutorial discretion. Putting aside for the moment the (very serious) injustice that comes with the inequitable use of prosecutorial discretion, let's…

> "Heck, jaywalking tickets given out as though by speed camera."

This has been a thing since 2017: https://futurism.com/facial-recognition-china-social-credit

- "Since April 2017, this city in China's Guangdong province has deployed a rather intense technique to deter jaywalking. Anyone who crosses against the light will find their face, name, and part of their government ID number displayed on a large LED screen above the intersection, thanks to facial recognition devices all over the city."

- "If that feels invasive, you don't even know the half of it. Now, Motherboard reports that a Chinese artificial intelligence company is partnering the system with mobile carriers, so that offenders receive a text message with a fine as soon as they are caught."

Re: AI and Mass Spying

#98

Post by mkesper »

renegat0x0 wrote: post #52

The author makes one mistake. He said that Google stopped spying on gmail. - they started spying on user's gmail - there was blowback, they reverted - after some time they introduced "smart features", with ads again Link https://www.askvg.com/gmail-showing-ads-inside-email-message... I do not even want to check if "smart features" are opt-in, or opt-out.

It's opt-in but hey, you're missing out if not enabling it!

Re: AI and Mass Spying

#99

Post by Pxtl »

somenameforme wrote: post #58

This is a political problem, not a technological one. The USSR (alongside Germany and others) managed effective at scale spying with primitive technology: paperwork for everything and every movement, informants, audio surveillance, and so on. The reason such things did not come to places like the US in the same way is not because we were incapable of such, but because there was no political interest in it. And when o…

> wrong opinion

That phrase is doing a lot of work.

Re: AI and Mass Spying

#100

Post by thesuperbigfrog »

yterdy wrote: post #47
thesuperbigfrog wrote: post #27

The new Google, Meta, Microsoft, etc. bots won't just crawl the web or social networks--they will crawl specific topics and people. Lots of cultures have the concept of a "guardian angel" or "ancestral spirits" that watch over the lives of their descendants. In the not-so-distant technofedualist future you'll have a "personal assistant bot" provided by a large corporation that will "help" you by answering questions,…

That's just your phone.

>> That's just your phone.

That is how most people will interface with their "personal assistant bot".

Don't be surprised if it listens to all your phone conversations, reads all your text messages and email, and curates all your contacts in order to "better help you".

When you login to your $LARGE_CORPORATION account on your laptop or desktop computer, the same bot(s) will be there to "help" and collect data in a similar manner.

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