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Skill Doesn’t Matter If You Lack Taste

nathanbarry.com

31–40 of 44 posts

Re: Skill Doesn’t Matter If You Lack Taste

#31
Taste depends on expectation and convention. There's no absolute standard to apply, only local and traditional practices.

As others have pointed out, the Star Wars transitions are part of the conceit of the movies. As an old fart, I grew up watching the movie serials that the Star Wars, and Indiana Jones, movies are made in homage of. If you aren't familiar with them then you are watching a very different movie than I am.

This is probably one of the reasons that I rather like the prequels; I'm viewing them in the context that they were created in. If Lucas erred it was in expecting future generations to be aware of the context and not expecting them to simply take the movies at face value. Since the movies made a lot of money, I don't feel he erred by much.

Lucas also is referencing a lot of post war Japanese film narrative technique; this is less critical to "reading" the film, though.

I've never heard anyone who knows about film narrative technique say that Lucas was an "unskilled" film maker. As for the films literary quality, YMMV.

Re: Skill Doesn’t Matter If You Lack Taste

#33

"If you watch the newer Star Wars movies pay attention to the transitions near the end. When they are switching between each of the battle scenes they use Powerpoint style transitions. Dissolve, blinds, swipe. It’s an amateur effect in a movie that is otherwise very technically difficult and visually impressive. The skill is there, but taste is lacking." I'm sure the use of dissolves and wipes in the newer Star Wars…

To add to this, those wipes are very deliberate homages to the Flash Gordan serials and other films from that era that George Lucas watched as reruns when he was a child. Those exact wipes were in the originals too. Its just a fun little thing they put in the movies to give this quick-paced serial feel to them and to pay homage to 30s sci-fi no one really cares about. I'm so sick of this Lucas bashing. He is incredib…

Part of that is because Dylan produced two great albums (Love and Theft and Modern Times) in the last decade, and Together Through Life wasn't half bad either.

And plenty of people have remarked that the Stones haven't been relevant in forever.

But I think more people are angry that he won't leave the original trilogy alone.

Re: Skill Doesn’t Matter If You Lack Taste

#35

Taste is subjective and fleeting. The once lauded tastes of the 90s are now regarded as oh so dreadfully pedestrian by enlightened contemporary minds. The crux of taste is rooted in celebrity worship and group think. Taste is a roll of the die and a hope that your vision resonates with those around you. It's no coincidence that every great artist is eventually regarded as jumping the shark; their tastes evolve or rem…

Taste is subjective and fleeting. The once lauded tastes of the 90s are now regarded as oh so dreadfully pedestrian by enlightened contemporary minds.

You seem to have specific examples in mind. I have no idea what they are on this side of your skull. More specific language would be appreciated.

The crux of taste is rooted in celebrity worship and group think. Taste is a roll of the die and a hope that your vision resonates with those around you.

A lot of what is called "taste" is group think. Not all of it is, however. In addition to "taste" there is also Taste. A number of the hallmarks of Taste in instrumental music, like the ability to use slight modulation of rhythm to convey the visceral feeling of specific dance steps, are demonstrably cross cultural and enduring across generations. Many of the hallmarks of Taste in visual design (rule of thirds) have endured over hundreds of years. Note that these examples are rooted in the function of the human sensorium -- that's not coincidence.

This isn't to say that absolutely everything Louis Armstrong's contemporaries did still resonates today. It also isn't to say that absolutely everything the old masters painted resonates with 21st century viewers. But note how much of what Louis Armstrong and Michaelangelo did which still resonates and which contemporary artists still include in their practice. We now know from science that people are not "blank slates." This notion was just an ideological fiction. Our senses and perceptions mostly work in a particular way, and this is bound to give rise to Taste.

That said, you are mostly right, and our functioning as social animals with the ability to maintain ideologies as a group bonding mechanism also gives rise to "taste."

Taste is almost negligible.

If by this, you mean that the ratio of Taste/"taste" is frustratingly close to zero, I'd say you're right. Groupthink is agonizingly powerful, but that's only most of what there is, not all of it. (Sturgeon's Law)

Re: Skill Doesn’t Matter If You Lack Taste

#37

Taste is subjective and fleeting. The once lauded tastes of the 90s are now regarded as oh so dreadfully pedestrian by enlightened contemporary minds. The crux of taste is rooted in celebrity worship and group think. Taste is a roll of the die and a hope that your vision resonates with those around you. It's no coincidence that every great artist is eventually regarded as jumping the shark; their tastes evolve or rem…

Steve Jobs had taste, I doubt he was subject to groupthink, though.

Re: Skill Doesn’t Matter If You Lack Taste

#38

Reminds me of Ira Glass on taste and work: "Nobody tells this to people who are beginners, I wish someone told me. All of us who do creative work, we get into it because we have good taste. But there is this gap. For the first couple years you make stuff, it's just not that good. It's trying to be good, it has potential, but it's not. But your taste, the thing that got you into the game, is still killer. And your tas…

I like the quote, but am always turned off by the use "good taste" there, where it seems more appropriate to say "a particular taste."

You create because you have a particular taste, you are successful if you have "good" taste as measured by the market. Also because you are self-critical and self-aware; you can't improve until you realize that your current output is crap.

Re: Skill Doesn’t Matter If You Lack Taste

#39

Taste is subjective and fleeting. The once lauded tastes of the 90s are now regarded as oh so dreadfully pedestrian by enlightened contemporary minds. The crux of taste is rooted in celebrity worship and group think. Taste is a roll of the die and a hope that your vision resonates with those around you. It's no coincidence that every great artist is eventually regarded as jumping the shark; their tastes evolve or rem…

Taste is subjective and fleeting. The once lauded tastes of the 90s are now regarded as oh so dreadfully pedestrian by enlightened contemporary minds. You seem to have specific examples in mind. I have no idea what they are on this side of your skull. More specific language would be appreciated. The crux of taste is rooted in celebrity worship and group think. Taste is a roll of the die and a hope that your vision re…

You seem to have specific examples in mind. I have no idea what they are on this side of your skull. More specific language would be appreciated.

That was a bit tongue-in-cheek, my point is that tastes are in a state of perpetual change and instances that are regarded as representations of "good taste" are generally reflections of today's zeitgeist. Taste (as in gustation) is a good analog for social taste; people have a general idea of what tastes good to other people, but they almost always know what they like to eat and they also know that everyone is different and preferences in taste vary over time and by location. A good chef (someone that might be regarded as having good taste), certainly has his own preferences, but his skill is the capacity to engineer a dish that meets the requirements of any taste (because "good" depends on the taster)

A number of the hallmarks of Taste in instrumental music, like the ability to use slight modulation of rhythm to convey the visceral feeling of specific dance steps, are demonstrably cross cultural and enduring across generations.

What you describe are skills. Someone who "has taste" simply has preferences that align with those around them; catering to taste is just marketing. This is not to say that works of intrinsic merit don't exist, but those who can appreciate the finer details of a given work (in any domain) are rare, thus we rely on the social taste as a heuristic for determining which things are good. Those who pay little attention to the trends around them and simply serve their own preferences/apathy are regarded as tasteless. Even those cheesy Star Wars transitions were hip at one time.

Re: Skill Doesn’t Matter If You Lack Taste

#40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Taste is subjective and fleeting. The once lauded tastes of the 90s are now regarded as oh so dreadfully pedestrian by enlightened contemporary minds. You seem to have specific examples in mind. I have no idea what they are on this side of your skull. More specific language would be appreciated. The crux of taste is rooted in celebrity worship and group think. Taste is a roll of the die and a hope that your vision re…

You seem to have specific examples in mind. I have no idea what they are on this side of your skull. More specific language would be appreciated. That was a bit tongue-in-cheek, my point is that tastes are in a state of perpetual change and instances that are regarded as representations of "good taste" are generally reflections of today's zeitgeist. Taste (as in gustation) is a good analog for social taste; people ha…

What you describe are skills.

They are not just skills. The things I am referring to are tied to >awarenesslisteningThis is not to say that works of intrinsic merit don't exist, but those who can appreciate the finer details of a given work (in any domain) are rare, thus we rely on the social taste as a heuristic for determining which things are good.

The former is Taste, the latter is "taste." The latter is like the people who only know they should become enthusiastic when opera singers hit the high note.

Those who pay little attention to the trends around them and simply serve their own preferences/apathy are regarded as tasteless.

This depends. Those who serve their own "taste" and fail to keep up with trends are eventually regarded as "tasteless" because they are using an outdated set of expectations. However, those with Taste, while they might be temporarily disregarded by those with "taste," eventually withstand the test of time. Often, when we are lucky, those with Taste set the trends.

Even those cheesy Star Wars transitions were hip at one time.

Yes, but when it comes to Taste, what matters is how well those transitions work in the context of the work they're in. Certain paints, techniques, themes can go in and out of "style" but what really matters is: did it work? (At a deeper level than mere expectations.)

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