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Cocoa harvested by kids as young as 5 in Ghana: CBS News investigation

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Re: Cocoa harvested by kids as young as 5 in Ghana: CBS News investigation

#11

Post by the-alchemist »

RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #4

> Munira, 15, is one of those children. She has worked in the cocoa fields since she was 5 years old. Education is a luxury, with her school an hour-long walk away and transportation options expensive. Last year, her family harvested only one bag of decent-quality cocoa. A 140-pound bag of the product fetches only about $115. I think child labor is actually a symptom of a deeper problem and cracking down on child lab…

This.

We would all benefit from more cause and effect analysis in our media.

- Let's say we increase prices that we pay cocoa farmers, even double the price

- Is this extra enough to send the girl to school an hour away, pay for her books, etc.? If you pay the family more, how do you know they would spend it on the girl's education? Maybe fixing the water well or building a sturdier house is more important. Or paying off debt.

- The school is an hour away, the girl might not feel safe being away from home for so long without any adults. She might prefer being with her family. So... boarding school? Are the teachers qualified? (Go read about absentee teachers in Indian schools.)

- Also, if cocoa farming becomes more profitable, it might encourage _more_ child labor as parents pull their kids from school to work "on the family farm".

- If cocoa farming is profitable enough, it might invite a protection racket. Go Google for Mexican cartels and avocados.

Ironically, here in the U.S., we kinda glorify "working on the family farm", expecting kids to help on their parents' farms. Isn't that family doing something similar?

I am in no way glorifying child labor. I think it's sad and I wish I could adopt all these children and give them the quality of life I enjoy.

But complex problems require complex solutions. Unfortunately, we--humanity as a whole--have not found a universal solution to end human suffering as a whole, even the small subset of misery like child labor.

Historically, almost every country that has "developed" into an "industrialized" nation has had a very difficult, dangerous, violent learning curve. Kids in coal mines in the U.S., 18th century Dickensian English was a hellhole...

Re: Cocoa harvested by kids as young as 5 in Ghana: CBS News investigation

#12

Post by User23 »

benj111 wrote: post #7
RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #4

> Munira, 15, is one of those children. She has worked in the cocoa fields since she was 5 years old. Education is a luxury, with her school an hour-long walk away and transportation options expensive. Last year, her family harvested only one bag of decent-quality cocoa. A 140-pound bag of the product fetches only about $115. I think child labor is actually a symptom of a deeper problem and cracking down on child lab…

150 years ago child labour in the West was common. If you can barely afford food then everyone needs to work to earn money. I'm kind of in two minds, from their point of view there's probably nothing wrong, but that's incompatible with our morals. But then we obviously aren't willing to pay for those morals.

Child labor is still not uncommon in agricultural communities in the USA. I believe the federal law is age 12 and up for farm work. And de facto if not de jure there is no age limit on children working their own family’s farm. Granted one might call that chores rather than labor.

And the minimum age to babysit is as low as 8 based on a quick search.

Re: Cocoa harvested by kids as young as 5 in Ghana: CBS News investigation

#14

Post by janice1999 »

bell-cot wrote: post #3

> Munira, 15, is one of those children. [...] Last year, her family harvested only one bag of decent-quality cocoa. A 140-pound bag of the product fetches only about $115. Sounds like "child labor" is downstream of the actual problem.

Call me a bleeding heart but child labor is an 'actual' problem. You can keep destructing societal issues until you reinvent the universe from scratch. It may be difficult to solve global poverty but it's not a lot to ask extremely profitable companies to enforce the supply chain checks they've committed to.

Re: Cocoa harvested by kids as young as 5 in Ghana: CBS News investigation

#15

Post by JumpCrisscross »

maxwell wrote: post #6
java-man wrote: post #2

Charge the CEOs of companies that buy cocoa with child abuse.

They were charged, but the Supreme Court ruled in their favor. https://www.cnbc.com/2021/06/17/supreme-court-rules-in-favor...

> were charged

They were sued. That's reasonable. (SCOTUS overturned it. I don't know the relevant law well enough to comment on it.)

Criminally charging executives would be tantamount to putting Ghana's cocoa sector under U.S. sanctions.

Re: Cocoa harvested by kids as young as 5 in Ghana: CBS News investigation

#16

Post by josu »

janice1999 wrote: post #14
bell-cot wrote: post #3

> Munira, 15, is one of those children. [...] Last year, her family harvested only one bag of decent-quality cocoa. A 140-pound bag of the product fetches only about $115. Sounds like "child labor" is downstream of the actual problem.

Call me a bleeding heart but child labor is an 'actual' problem. You can keep destructing societal issues until you reinvent the universe from scratch. It may be difficult to solve global poverty but it's not a lot to ask extremely profitable companies to enforce the supply chain checks they've committed to.

Child labor tends to go away with the increase in GDP.

Re: Cocoa harvested by kids as young as 5 in Ghana: CBS News investigation

#17

Post by talldatethrow »

RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #4

> Munira, 15, is one of those children. She has worked in the cocoa fields since she was 5 years old. Education is a luxury, with her school an hour-long walk away and transportation options expensive. Last year, her family harvested only one bag of decent-quality cocoa. A 140-pound bag of the product fetches only about $115. I think child labor is actually a symptom of a deeper problem and cracking down on child lab…

I feel for the kid, but to be realistic it doesn't take several people all year to grow 140 lbs of something.

This is just a small portion of all the farming they do, including for themselves to eat.

Re: Cocoa harvested by kids as young as 5 in Ghana: CBS News investigation

#18

Post by 1oooqooq »

bell-cot wrote: post #3

> Munira, 15, is one of those children. [...] Last year, her family harvested only one bag of decent-quality cocoa. A 140-pound bag of the product fetches only about $115. Sounds like "child labor" is downstream of the actual problem.

Are you suggesting the workers unite and take over the means of production, comrade bell-cot?

Re: Cocoa harvested by kids as young as 5 in Ghana: CBS News investigation

#19

Post by benj111 »

User23 wrote: post #12
benj111 wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

150 years ago child labour in the West was common. If you can barely afford food then everyone needs to work to earn money. I'm kind of in two minds, from their point of view there's probably nothing wrong, but that's incompatible with our morals. But then we obviously aren't willing to pay for those morals.

Child labor is still not uncommon in agricultural communities in the USA. I believe the federal law is age 12 and up for farm work. And de facto if not de jure there is no age limit on children working their own family’s farm. Granted one might call that chores rather than labor. And the minimum age to babysit is as low as 8 based on a quick search.

Yes. I was thinking more, chimney sweeping and factory work.

My point was we were poor then and had different standards. They probably have those same standards as we had for the same reasons. We have different standards now, so it's on us to do something if we want to.

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