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Nvidia sued for stealing trade secrets: blunder showed rival company's code

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Re: Nvidia sued for stealing trade secrets: blunder showed rival company's code

#101
post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't have direct knowledge of this company or the parties involved but I would be highly doubtful that Nvidia would want to have an employee steal the secrets of a competitor/partner. In my experience, companies of this size would aggressively not want tainted IP inside their companies. He would need to be bringing across something as valuable as AGI, cure for cancer, etc for it to be even worth considering. There…

Would Nvidia the company want to engage in this? No. Would some middle manager involved in poaching this guy from the competitor want to do it? I have my suspicions. It takes two to tango and Nvidia didn't catch this themselves which raises some red flags. How was he hired? What kind of compensation was he able to negotiate? Was it well above the compensation Nvidia would ordinarily pay for an engineer of his level?…

>Would some middle manager involved in poaching this guy from the competitor want to do it? I have my suspicions.

No company or manager I ever worked at, at both good and bad companies, would even think you'd be bringing stolen proprietary IP from your old job let alone allow something like this to happen under their nose with their knowledge.

They're far too afraid of IP lawsuits, as knowledge of the use of stolen IP can easily leak, and you then rating out that manager making them an accomplice, for anyone to allow for something like this to happen with their blessing. And plus, you never want to hire IP thieves, if they stole source code from their old job they'll steal from you as well.

>How was he hired?

Most likely Nvidia poached the guy on the premise he's gonna build form them something very similar to what he was working on at Valeo. The guy probably sold himself well to get the senior job at Nvidia but most likely knew he overpromised and would underdeliver, so to make his life easy at his new job, he took all the sourcecode and documents from his old job to use at is next job.

>How did he introduce the code into Nvidia's version control?

Well it's not like he was dumb enough to just dump in git all the stolen source code from Valeo with all the headers, variable names and copyright notices and nobody would notice. Most likely he kept the code on the laptop as an offline copy and only used it as inspiration for the code he wrote for Nvidia or maybe he even bluntly took Valeo's source code then pruned, redacted or renamed any and all references to Valeo and checked it in as Nvidia's project so nobody was the wiser that the code was not originally written by him.

Re: Nvidia sued for stealing trade secrets: blunder showed rival company's code

#102
post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Violating patents is one thing, as you're only violating the concept/idea, but the implementation is still up to you The concept/idea is not what is patented. The patent is (or should be) for the specific execution of the idea. Competitors are free to implement their feature using methods other that what is covered by the patent, even if the end result gives the exact same functionality.

> The concept/idea is not what is patented. The patent is (or should be) for the specific execution of the idea. Competitors are free to implement their feature using methods other that what is covered by the patent, even if the end result gives the exact same functionality. IP lawyer here (EDIT: not yours, of course): That's a considerable (and potentially-dangerous) oversimplification. What matters is whether what…

At some point I was told to never ever look at a competitor's patents, because doing so would worsen the penalties if it turned out that our design infringed upon them. Can you confirm that's true?

Doesn't that mean that in general it is also a really bad idea to ask an engineer questions about a particular piece of tech that they patented at a previous employer, even though the specific information is a matter of public record by virtue of being explained in the patent?

Re: Nvidia sued for stealing trade secrets: blunder showed rival company's code

#103
post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Germans. > Mohammad Moniruzzaman Very German.

By that name it could be a modern Spaniard, French or German fully assimilated to the culture. Specially if he was born there.

>fully assimilated to the culture

The culture of stealing IP from your employer?

Re: Nvidia sued for stealing trade secrets: blunder showed rival company's code

#104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Germans. We love printing, faxing and scanning stuff.

>Germans. > Mohammad Moniruzzaman Very German.

I hope you don't write software that flags people by their name

Re: Nvidia sued for stealing trade secrets: blunder showed rival company's code

#105
post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The concept/idea is not what is patented. The patent is (or should be) for the specific execution of the idea. Competitors are free to implement their feature using methods other that what is covered by the patent, even if the end result gives the exact same functionality. IP lawyer here (EDIT: not yours, of course): That's a considerable (and potentially-dangerous) oversimplification. What matters is whether what…

At some point I was told to never ever look at a competitor's patents, because doing so would worsen the penalties if it turned out that our design infringed upon them. Can you confirm that's true? Doesn't that mean that in general it is also a really bad idea to ask an engineer questions about a particular piece of tech that they patented at a previous employer, even though the specific information is a matter of pu…

Willful infringement allows for up to triple damages. The expectation is you can't do willful infringement if you're not aware of competitor's patents, and you can't be aware of them if your policy is to never look at patent documents. Or that's the idea anyway.

Re: Nvidia sued for stealing trade secrets: blunder showed rival company's code

#106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Germans. > Mohammad Moniruzzaman Very German.

I hope you don't write software that flags people by their name

FYI, a lot of other nationalities besides German work in Germany. It's natural to find immigrants in almost every company, especially the big international ones.

Re: Nvidia sued for stealing trade secrets: blunder showed rival company's code

#107
post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> nasty, naasssssty GPL! What does that mean? Why would scanning for gpl code be looked at badly? It presumably means a company is proactively abiding by gpl licensing. The only thing better would be to use gpl and share their source as well. But of course it's a legit choice to just not use any gpl'd code. It's probably more common to just turn a blind eye to gpl code, so it's good to see companies making sure they'…

It was a joke. I'm not a fan of "viral" licenses, and agree that, if a company doesn't want to abide by the license, they should not include them, but I am also not a fan of trying to force others to force others, to force others, etc., ad nauseam . I tend to use MIT, which isn't always everyone's cup of tea, but means that you can use my code, and it would be nice to be credited, but I won't cry myself to sleep, if…

The MIT license requires giving credit. The difference between MIT and GPL is that GPL requires sharing the modified source code and licensing it the same.

Re: Nvidia sued for stealing trade secrets: blunder showed rival company's code

#108
post #7

TFA makes it sound as if the entirety of the blame can be placed on one employee. Sure, his actions do seem to support that view, but then again, Nvidia did hire him precisely for his previous experience at this rival company, on the very same project that the two companies were partnered on, which is the same project that Nvidia hired him for. There is no argument to be made that Nvidia wasn't aware he'd be coming w…

> Nvidia did hire him precisely for his previous experience at this rival company, on the very same project that the two companies were partnered on, which is the same project that Nvidia hired him for. Yes, this happens all the time. > There is no argument to be made that Nvidia wasn't aware he'd be coming with secrets. This is not a logical conclusion from the above. Hiring for the exp is fine. Hiring for the trade…

And nobody at NVDA noticed when the employee pushed several GB of code into NVDA's repos?

Re: Nvidia sued for stealing trade secrets: blunder showed rival company's code

#109
post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

400 GH repos: https://github.com/orgs/NVIDIA/repositories Not to mention tons of other projects that live outside of the main org, contributions to other projects all over the place, etc. So much hate for free software. The “I hate Nvidia because all I know is their driver is proprietary” schtick is old. They crossed the $1T mark in value solely because of the almost completely open source ecosystem (a large portion…

CUDA. Non-free firmware. Still bad. And Radeon the same, propietary firmware run by the kernel is needed sometimes to even boot the GPU, it just happens Linux-Libre patches it and the Modesetting driver will work fine until you call 3D accelerated calls, when that happens the system may either panic or crash X entirely. That can be fixed by setting RenderAccel to none in the X.org config file.

These plus Raspberry Pi firmware, Intel ME, the list goes on and on.

RISC-V is so exciting and interesting because it’s practically the first time in modern history 100% open source meets reality.

People that act as though Nvidia is the exception here should just say they hate Nvidia for personal reasons - and that’s fair and fine.

Again, they’re not angels and they do all kinds of shady things but to single them out vs practically every company in history is just bizarre.

Re: Nvidia sued for stealing trade secrets: blunder showed rival company's code

#110

TFA makes it sound as if the entirety of the blame can be placed on one employee. Sure, his actions do seem to support that view, but then again, Nvidia did hire him precisely for his previous experience at this rival company, on the very same project that the two companies were partnered on, which is the same project that Nvidia hired him for. There is no argument to be made that Nvidia wasn't aware he'd be coming w…

A problem here is that while the companies will generally make very clear that they don't want you to have any single line of code, any schematic, any drawing, anything at all from your previous company; they may also expect you to bring "experience" from the previous company, thereby pressuring more junior employees into doing exactly that - bringing some docs from the previous company - but not telling about it. Th…

That sounds wrong in so many ways. Do you live in China or something where this is expected?

I've worked at about 10 or so companies in 3 countries and it was never expected for the juniors to ever "bring documents from previous workplaces as knowledge and not tell about it".

Bringing your "experience" means only the experience and problem solving skills that are in your head as we're in the knowledge work business. Bringing documents to regurgitate just means IP theft, not knowledge work and is no guarantee to make you a productive employee, and no company would ever touch you for ever doing that.

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