Live data from Hacker News

Light Table - a new IDE concept

chris-granger.com

111–120 of 315 posts

Re: Light Table - a new IDE concept

#111

Isn't it ironic that this is posted on a site that does startup funding and the comments are "please put this on kickstarter" not "please apply for Y Combinator"? Is it possible that Kickstarter will disrupt Y combinator style startup funding? If we (the consumers) can bypass the investors and pay for what we want, why do we need the startup gatekeepers? Obviously this wouldn't work for all startups but a large porti…

Kickstarter let's you basically preorder a product that lacks investors.

Being a startup investor has become the game rich people love to play. There are people who'll fund anything in return for a small percentage of the company in the hopes it might be the next Google/Facebook/Paypal ...

Billionaires don't want to be in the smallprinted section of the forbes-list, they want to be "legends" like Peter Thiel or Andy Bechtolsheim and want their name in the history books

Re: Light Table - a new IDE concept

#112

Isn't it ironic that this is posted on a site that does startup funding and the comments are "please put this on kickstarter" not "please apply for Y Combinator"? Is it possible that Kickstarter will disrupt Y combinator style startup funding? If we (the consumers) can bypass the investors and pay for what we want, why do we need the startup gatekeepers? Obviously this wouldn't work for all startups but a large porti…

Probably the people who mentioned kickstarter tend to think kickstarter for ideas without large profit potential, and unless you also sell a software-deployment platform (like Microsoft and Apple do) tools for programmers does not IMHO have large profit potential.

I'm not sure I agree. Textmate made a crap ton of money, companies like JetBrains and DevExpress have made very successful businesses building dev tools.

And while you mention MSFT as building a platform, if VS alone can make a billion, even without a platform I suspect you could do quite well.

Re: Light Table - a new IDE concept

#113
post #68
post #8

I can't get my hands on this soon enough. It makes so much sense: we're moving away from the files and folders metaphor everywhere, so why not in the IDE too?

We might not want the hassle of dealing with files and folders all the time, but I sometimes worry that a new generation of "programmers" will emerge who have no understanding of how the underlying filesystem works.

Maybe that is a good thing? If programmers have no assumptions or presumptions about files and filesystems, then they are open for innovating new stuff without the burden of legacy.

Re: Light Table - a new IDE concept

#114
post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We might not want the hassle of dealing with files and folders all the time, but I sometimes worry that a new generation of "programmers" will emerge who have no understanding of how the underlying filesystem works.

I sometimes worry that a new generation of "programmers" will emerge who have no understanding of how the underlying anything works. For as useful as sites like stackoverflow are for sharing knowledge, it is potentially encouraging a generation of copy/paste coders who's job it is to find and glue snippets together until they get the desired outcome. Maybe I'm getting old, but I'm starting think some knowledge needs…

I think it would depend on the language to a certain extent. For example, good luck writing anything complicated in Python without touching files and directories, because every file is a module and every directory is a namespace.

A programmer obviously can't be expected to know how everything works, which is why we have abstractions. But I think abstractions need to be leak-proof to a certain extent before you can justify not knowing what lies below. The current state of file system abstractions is nowhere near that. They leak all over the place.

Re: Light Table - a new IDE concept

#115

Isn't it ironic that this is posted on a site that does startup funding and the comments are "please put this on kickstarter" not "please apply for Y Combinator"? Is it possible that Kickstarter will disrupt Y combinator style startup funding? If we (the consumers) can bypass the investors and pay for what we want, why do we need the startup gatekeepers? Obviously this wouldn't work for all startups but a large porti…

> Isn't it ironic that this is posted on a site that does startup funding and the comments are "please put this on kickstarter" not "please apply for Y Combinator"?

Why, one can do both :). (eg. Pebble is funded by Kickstarter, but the creators are an YC company)

Anyway, the most important thing is: make it happen, make it happen fast, and don't let it become another CodeBubbles - an IDE idea with a video that captured imagination of programers few years ago, but implementation of which is yet to be seen.

Re: Light Table - a new IDE concept

#117
post #67
post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Editing complex functions in a spreadsheet is an absolute nightmare though. AS long as he doesn't recreate that part we are good :)

Editing complex functions in a spreadsheet is an absolute nightmare Can you expand on why? Also, if you can imagine a spreadsheet that actually did a good job of this, what would it look like?

Spreadsheets would be nicer if they had a coherent dataflow model. Some spreadsheet programs do this automatically, but it could be a great place for a visual programming language too.

One ugly pattern that I'm often doing is to set a column with values by the function "A3=A2" and dragging that down. This gives a column of constant values which are tweakable by tweaking just the first element. That's what a scalar variable looks like in a spreadsheet. I'd like a separate calculation area where I could refer to these. Also when I select a column I might right-click and choose "Reduce → Mean", and the mean of that column could appear in the scalar area too. With some visual tinkering you might even have a sort of "iframe" containing the columns and the scalars at the bottom of the page, and have the mean appear underneath the column to remind me what it's the mean of -- but it should float; I shouldn't have to move it when I want to drag-down the calculation to enter in a few more rows.

With spreadsheet logic you have a couple of atomic operations like, "this is a fixed column specified by me," or "this is a column containing every half-int from 12.5 through 28.5" and so on. You have reductions of those list types, like Mean and Sum and Length. You have transformations of the data too, like NormalDist(x, mean, stdev). And some of them are cached-recursive, e.g. the running-sum function you might use to find a balance given a transaction history:

    balance[-1] = 0
    balance[i] = change[i] + balance[i - 1]
Finally you've got a wide variety of visualizations of that data, which might also be linked from the "scalar area" -- in fact it might be nice to develop ultrasmall "thumbnail versions" that update dynamically as the data updates.

I think those elements are sort of the "core" of a spreadsheet and are handled woefully inadequately by Excel, which was not originally designed for the popular usage case it has become.

Re: Light Table - a new IDE concept

#120
As concepts go, not a bad start. One of my immediate thoughts was that this would be better served on a multi-monitor system. Every single one of our development machines has three 24 inch 1920 x 1200 screens. It's fantastic. You can keep everything you need up and available. It makes working on complex ideas an absolute pleasure.

On the hardware design front we use a program use a EDA tool called Altium Designer for schematics and board design. This, by far, is the most well thought-out application I have seen when it comes to multi-monitor smarts. It makes for a nicely flowing and efficient design process.

Post reply on HN