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In the gut's 'second brain,' key agents of health emerge

quantamagazine.org

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Re: In the gut's 'second brain,' key agents of health emerge

#71

Post by theshrike79 »

Euphorbium wrote: post #56

I’ve recently moved to a meat heavy diet, and that pretty much fixed my ibs completely. I still get flare ups if I eat too many oranges or bananas, but eating meat on every meal is absolutely essential.

I'm the opposite, leaving out red meat made my gut feel a lot better. I do still eat the occasional beef burger, but mostly it's either vegan or fish/chicken.

This is the thing that's tripping up health professionals about gut health, people's guts are really different and there's no official accepted way of testing what kind of diet works for who.

Except for long-term experimentation and elimination and that's not "scientific", so we don't do that. Doctors just want to prescribe a pill that' fits everyone[0] and call it a day.

[0] everyone they bothered to test it on, so mostly white western males

Re: In the gut's 'second brain,' key agents of health emerge

#72

Post by xbmcuser »

devmor wrote: post #28

I really don't understand why it has taken health research this long to focus on the digestive system. Obviously, it's all hindsight - but the system that controls processing the entirety of our nutrients seems like it would clearly be a lot more important than it has been treated.

I don't think it has rather they have forgotten in the past looking at your shit was a very common way to diagnose your illness. At least that is the case in all old medical systems from Asia.

Re: In the gut's 'second brain,' key agents of health emerge

#73

Post by Modified3019 »

Dr_Birdbrain wrote: post #33
gardnr wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a high powered blender. I try to get the fiber and the probiotics at the same time. Fruits and vegetables have probiotics inside the flesh, not just on the skin. The science is less clear on supplements. [1] The night before I soak: * chia seeds (1 tsp) * psyllium husks (1 tsp) * quick oats (1 tsp) * almonds 17g In the morning I add in: * a frozen banana * kefir / fermented yogurt drink (1/2 cup) * frozen berr…

How much creatine, if I may ask?

*[Notice: diarrhea warning]*

For those that don't know, if you aren't used to creatine then taking more than a few grams has a good possibility of giving you the shits (or sometimes even strong abdominal discomfort). This will (mostly) go away fairly quickly and varies drastically from person to person, but you've been warned. Best to take it on a weekend or something, and slowly build up to your max dose.

The effect is pronounced if taken with only water, all at once.

Instead you can take it throughout the day be adding it to your water bottle. Taking it with meals also typically subdues the effect.

The effect I suppose is comparable to something like magnesium citrate. I suspect they are doing similar things osmotically.

Re: In the gut's 'second brain,' key agents of health emerge

#74

Post by JumpCrisscross »

theshrike79 wrote: post #68
numpad0 wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Food cooked more than 4 hours ago was considered poison. tbf, a random dish left under Indian room temperature for hours probably is actually unsafe. Mumbai right now is 32C/90F according to Google, which is about the worst temperature to leave food in.

There is a reason why salads aren't a thing in warmer countries. The same reason applies to people only drinking tea, not cold water. If it's not cooked, it might be actually dangerous.

> reason why salads aren't a thing in warmer countries

Meanwhile cooked chicken can be safely left on a countertop in Canton for hours? This model needs more variables.

Re: In the gut's 'second brain,' key agents of health emerge

#75

Post by JumpCrisscross »

theshrike79 wrote: post #71
Euphorbium wrote: post #56

I’ve recently moved to a meat heavy diet, and that pretty much fixed my ibs completely. I still get flare ups if I eat too many oranges or bananas, but eating meat on every meal is absolutely essential.

I'm the opposite, leaving out red meat made my gut feel a lot better. I do still eat the occasional beef burger, but mostly it's either vegan or fish/chicken. This is the thing that's tripping up health professionals about gut health, people's guts are really different and there's no official accepted way of testing what kind of diet works for who. Except for long-term experimentation and elimination and that's not "…

> the thing that's tripping up health professionals about gut health

This has been a staple of gut research for >2 decades. It entered the mainstream in the last one.

Re: In the gut's 'second brain,' key agents of health emerge

#76

Post by Eupolemos »

theshrike79 wrote: post #67
jimmySixDOF wrote: post #50

There was something about the vegus nerve being influenced by gut microbiota so it's also the parasympathetic not just the enteric nervous system but this is all hard to study I subscribed to u-Boime for a couple of years until that imploded spectacularly and the few snapshots I had are not enough of a sample size this whole field is so data poor and uncertain.

The vagus nerve is the weirdest thing. Had to dig into it a bit to figure out my acid reflux. Basically if I eat stuff that doesn't digest well, my stomach bloats and causes a mild hiatal hernia, which in turn presses on the vagus nerve that travels right next to it. This causes the _exact_ same symptoms as a panic attack. Cold hands and feet, the feeling of an increased heart rate etc. Not super fun when you have a…

Hi - this sounds exactly like what my GF is figthing with bloating, really cold hands and feet and anxiety attacks. She used to have a severe reflux issue.

Can I ask you, what medicine do you take to relax the esophageal sphincter?

When it comes to food, have you found a pattern in what to avoid or do just stick to some basic kinds to avoid?

Re: In the gut's 'second brain,' key agents of health emerge

#77

Post by Modified3019 »

gumby wrote: post #54
gardnr wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a high powered blender. I try to get the fiber and the probiotics at the same time. Fruits and vegetables have probiotics inside the flesh, not just on the skin. The science is less clear on supplements. [1] The night before I soak: * chia seeds (1 tsp) * psyllium husks (1 tsp) * quick oats (1 tsp) * almonds 17g In the morning I add in: * a frozen banana * kefir / fermented yogurt drink (1/2 cup) * frozen berr…

What’s the point of eating collagen when you’re already eating protein powder? Why do you think your gut would process it differently from any other protein?

As mentioned by the other buy, something like whey powder or meat will have a very different amino acid profile compared to collagen. Like fatty acids and carbohydrates, amino acids get lumped together as a group, but they all have very different effects in the body (including competition).

Most people don't need to care, but amino acid balance can sometimes be a significant factor to health issues because of all the interactions involved, especially if intake has been tilted by a particular way of eating. It's reasonable to balance out whey protein with collagen.

Honestly the topic is so convoluted that with my current grasp of if, I can't currently make a useful or broadly applicable statement beyond "some people find collagen or glycine supplementation beneficial for their X". Individual trial and error basically, much like neurotransmitter affecting medication.

Re: In the gut's 'second brain,' key agents of health emerge

#78

Post by kromem »

So this is really cool. I've been super interested in this one gene mutation called LRRK2 which has a really bizarre link to details in contentious debates over history (too long to include in this comment).

The gene mutation is connected to both Crohn's disease and Parkinson's.

So after seeing this article about how glial issues are connected to Crohn's, my immediate thought was - well, what about Parkinson's?

And indeed, it looks like the LRRK2 mutation contributes to Parkinson's by screwing up the glial cells:

Is Glial Dysfunction the Key Pathogenesis of LRRK2-Linked Parkinson’s Disease? (2023): https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9856048/

(I can't wait for LLMs to advance enough that parallel discoveries in subdomains are teased out as further cross discipline research candidates.)

Re: In the gut's 'second brain,' key agents of health emerge

#79

Post by kumarvvr »

sirtaj wrote: post #60
kumarvvr wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indian culture places very strict restrictions about food. 1. No outside food. For even until a decade ago, eating out was considered a last resort. The idea is that one must be aware of what exactly goes into ones food, and that usually meant home cooked food. 2. There are a variety of foods and flavors in India, that are recommended for various circumstances and contexts. Pregnant women had a well defined diet regi…

This sounds a lot like a specific caste's food culture than general Indian culture. Dhabas and street vendors didn't pop up overnight.

I can guess the insinuation, but these norms were in place, culturally, across the spectrum.

Sure, some castes (like Brahmins) have had stricter rules, while some had laxer ones (for Kshatriyas, Vysyas & Sudras)

But I do know that eating out and eating only freshly cooked food was always the norm.

Also, Dhabas and Street Vendors, are a relatively newer thing, starting up in about 1800's.

Re: In the gut's 'second brain,' key agents of health emerge

#80

Post by kumarvvr »

numpad0 wrote: post #65
kumarvvr wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indian culture places very strict restrictions about food. 1. No outside food. For even until a decade ago, eating out was considered a last resort. The idea is that one must be aware of what exactly goes into ones food, and that usually meant home cooked food. 2. There are a variety of foods and flavors in India, that are recommended for various circumstances and contexts. Pregnant women had a well defined diet regi…

> Food cooked more than 4 hours ago was considered poison. tbf, a random dish left under Indian room temperature for hours probably is actually unsafe. Mumbai right now is 32C/90F according to Google, which is about the worst temperature to leave food in.

If we dig deeper into the norms, some foods were allowed to be taken even after 24 hours (Tamrind Rice, My grandmother always said Tamrind rice tastes better after a day, and it was ok to consume, but would raise a fit if I ate rice that was cooked in the morning).

Some foods were allowed to be taken upto 8-10 hours after cooking.

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