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Portugal just ran on 100% renewables for six days in a row

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Re: Portugal just ran on 100% renewables for six days in a row

#11

Post by gustavus »

wongarsu wrote: post #7
antuneza wrote: post #2

If you need the gas plants ready to dispatch at any moment, can you still say you are running on 100% renewables?

As long as the gas plants aren't burning any natural gas, I would say that's fair. Standing by to supplement power on load spikes is one of the primary roles of gas plants (together with pumped hydro), and that they didn't need to supply any electricity over those six days is noteworthy. From a climate standpoint there also isn't much wrong with having generating capacity in fossil fuels, what matters is how many gre…

Of course if they had a nuclear base they wouldn't even need the natural gas plants.

Re: Portugal just ran on 100% renewables for six days in a row

#13

Post by deburo »

defrost wrote: post #6
antuneza wrote: post #2

If you need the gas plants ready to dispatch at any moment, can you still say you are running on 100% renewables?

Yes - the plants are on standby, not consuming much beyond a "pilot light" worth of natural gas and not putting energy into the national grid. This is quite different to coal fired power generation which doesn't have low energy standby mode with rapid online to full generation ramping up in the manner of gas fired turbines. During the six day period the national grid was supplied only with energy from renewable sourc…

At what cost?

Re: Portugal just ran on 100% renewables for six days in a row

#14

Post by pmoleri »

melling wrote: post #4
antuneza wrote: post #2

If you need the gas plants ready to dispatch at any moment, can you still say you are running on 100% renewables?

People like these small wins. Population of Portugal is 10.5 million people. We have such a long way to go. Global fossil fuel will hopefully peak by the end of the decade. https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/world-oil-gas-coal-d...

> People like these small wins.

And for good reason, it proves wrong the mainstream thinking that this is impossible. Quite a few countries already run the full year over 90% renewable[1] and we still neglect it with all kind of excuses.

[1]: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_renewab...

Re: Portugal just ran on 100% renewables for six days in a row

#15

Post by helloooooooo »

gustavus wrote: post #11
wongarsu wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As long as the gas plants aren't burning any natural gas, I would say that's fair. Standing by to supplement power on load spikes is one of the primary roles of gas plants (together with pumped hydro), and that they didn't need to supply any electricity over those six days is noteworthy. From a climate standpoint there also isn't much wrong with having generating capacity in fossil fuels, what matters is how many gre…

Of course if they had a nuclear base they wouldn't even need the natural gas plants.

How would they regulate fluctuations in demand? Nuclear can’t do that. You need storage, or a reasonably scalable generation medium. Nuclear as a base load is moot

Re: Portugal just ran on 100% renewables for six days in a row

#16

Post by pmoleri »

dukeofdoom wrote: post #8

Huge waves in Portugal, when I visited. I'm guessing it's the wind coming off the Atlantic Ocean is strong and steady. And somewhat not common. Where I live, for most of the Winter the sky is overcast with clouds. So that somewhat limits solar panels. But I'm sure California is great place for them.

Tidal, waves, hydro, wind, solar, geothermal, biomass. Many options to choose from, it just takes political will.

Re: Portugal just ran on 100% renewables for six days in a row

#17

Post by mmasu »

pmoleri wrote: post #14
melling wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People like these small wins. Population of Portugal is 10.5 million people. We have such a long way to go. Global fossil fuel will hopefully peak by the end of the decade. https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/world-oil-gas-coal-d...

> People like these small wins. And for good reason, it proves wrong the mainstream thinking that this is impossible. Quite a few countries already run the full year over 90% renewable[1] and we still neglect it with all kind of excuses. [1]: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_renewab...

a lot of data there is pre-covid, would be interesting to see what’s happening today - especially in Europe, with the consequences of the Russia-Ukraine war on energy markets.

Re: Portugal just ran on 100% renewables for six days in a row

#18

Post by amanaplanacanal »

deburo wrote: post #13
defrost wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes - the plants are on standby, not consuming much beyond a "pilot light" worth of natural gas and not putting energy into the national grid. This is quite different to coal fired power generation which doesn't have low energy standby mode with rapid online to full generation ramping up in the manner of gas fired turbines. During the six day period the national grid was supplied only with energy from renewable sourc…

At what cost?

Wind and solar are cheap as chips. Hydro has always been cheaper than alternatives, where the geography is favorable.
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