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I visited over 120 EV chargers: why so many were broken

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Re: I visited over 120 EV chargers: why so many were broken

#51

Post by lesuorac »

dylan604 wrote: post #18
thesuitonym wrote: post #12

The main thing about these chargers is that nobody is monitoring them. At a gas station, an attendant is usually less than 20 feet away, and if anyone has a problem, they come talk to that person immediately. That attendant usually can't fix the problem on their own, but they can take steps to get it fixed quickly. By contrast, electric charging stations are typically at the far end of a vast sea of parking. There's…

The systems definitely have a method to communicate for payments, they should add a button to report issues with charger. Of course it's ripe for the button being pressed randomly, but I'm sure there's a smart person that can automate the messages received to catch that. But at least it would provide a possible mechanism to have frustrated users report these unattended units

Is that really necessary?

If your charger used to generate $X/day and all of the sudden generates $0/day most likely its broken.

Re: I visited over 120 EV chargers: why so many were broken

#52

Post by ajross »

outworlder wrote: post #6
brianwawok wrote: post #2

And in the over 100 Tesla chargers I have visited, I think maybe 1 was broken and not labeled. Good news is Tesla standard is coming to most car brands. Bad news is it's not here yet.

Relying on a single company seems like bad news to me. Imagine if your car could only refuel at Chevron stations. I get it that other charging networks also have the NACS connector. But if the argument is that they are unrealiable and people shouldn't bother, then Tesla will be the only game in town.

This seems backwards. You're demanding that people use alternatives in the market because of competition. But competition is what we have, and the market is choosing winners and losers. So... you're demanding we use the losers' products. So they can compete? Which they... aren't?

Re: I visited over 120 EV chargers: why so many were broken

#53

Post by ajross »

throwaway894345 wrote: post #43
taylodl wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This gets at the core as to why I've not (yet) bought an EV - it's absolutely insane that my car purchase dictates the people I have to associate with for refueling. As you point out - I would never buy a car having the stipulation I could only refuel at Chevron stations. I'll stick with my dino juice so long as Tesla is the only viable option available for recharging. I'd think about getting an EV for a local commut…

99% of the charging is at home anyway. People fixate too much on the public charge options (unless you are driving hundreds of miles a day, in which case the public chargers brands are probably the least of your worries).

Not 99% unless you never road trip at all. My fairly typical family Model Y with 30k miles has done 80% of its charging in our garage, per TeslaMate.

Re: I visited over 120 EV chargers: why so many were broken

#54

Post by ukd1 »

taylodl wrote: post #19
outworlder wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Relying on a single company seems like bad news to me. Imagine if your car could only refuel at Chevron stations. I get it that other charging networks also have the NACS connector. But if the argument is that they are unrealiable and people shouldn't bother, then Tesla will be the only game in town.

This gets at the core as to why I've not (yet) bought an EV - it's absolutely insane that my car purchase dictates the people I have to associate with for refueling. As you point out - I would never buy a car having the stipulation I could only refuel at Chevron stations. I'll stick with my dino juice so long as Tesla is the only viable option available for recharging. I'd think about getting an EV for a local commut…

I think you're mis-informed.

Teslas can easily charge at other branded recharging stations; mostly you never see it as there is no point. The Tesla ones are good. There are adaptors to all / most public charging stations for cheap. I keep a few, and my wall-charger (for 120/220v outlets) in the front-trunk.

Non-Teslas charging at Tesla stations is new/not really a thing though.

Re: I visited over 120 EV chargers: why so many were broken

#55

Post by david422 »

I have an electric vehicle that I charge in my garage. One day that charger broke and I had to charge at other locations for several weeks.

There are very few fast chargers in my area. When they were not in use, some were broken.

This leaves a pretty big dilemma: My car is low on juice, where do I go? By the time I actually get to an unused charger, it might be taken, or it might be broken. As long as it's not broken, I might have to wait for a charger to free up, especially a location that only has a single charger. And then wait for my car to charge. This can add up to a significant amount of time, and even more so if I have to use a non-fast charger. This time sink is very difficult to work around when you have other responsibilities.

I can only imagine that as people get more EVs, this problem will get a lot worse until infrastructure improves.

Re: I visited over 120 EV chargers: why so many were broken

#57

Post by ajross »

bryanlarsen wrote: post #20
zamfi wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Europe, yes. In, fact, European Teslas all come with CCS connectors now. In the USA, though, nearly every major vehicle manufacturer has announced a transition to NACS, the Tesla connector standard.

To be more precise, NACS uses the Tesla physical connector but the CCS signalling protocol. In consequence: 1: Cars with CCS Type 1 connectors can use a dumb physical adapter to connect to a NACS charger. 2: Older Tesla's (prior to ~2020 depending on model) need a $400 retrofit to be able to charge at non-Tesla NACS chargers. (The $400 retrofit includes a CCS Type 1 adapter, so it might eventually be cheaper without…

To clarify #2: the retrofit is the newer controller board that speaks CCS. This is the same thing they've been offering as a "CCS upgrade". It's otherwise unrelated to the NACS switchover, though obviously those are CCS-protocol devices and thus work with it.

Re: I visited over 120 EV chargers: why so many were broken

#58

Post by chroma »

taylodl wrote: post #19
outworlder wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Relying on a single company seems like bad news to me. Imagine if your car could only refuel at Chevron stations. I get it that other charging networks also have the NACS connector. But if the argument is that they are unrealiable and people shouldn't bother, then Tesla will be the only game in town.

This gets at the core as to why I've not (yet) bought an EV - it's absolutely insane that my car purchase dictates the people I have to associate with for refueling. As you point out - I would never buy a car having the stipulation I could only refuel at Chevron stations. I'll stick with my dino juice so long as Tesla is the only viable option available for recharging. I'd think about getting an EV for a local commut…

You can charge Teslas at other charging stations. It’s just that other chargers are inconvenient and unreliable. You usually need an adapter. You have to pull out a credit card and maybe install an app on your phone. With the Tesla chargers you just plug in and everything’s billed automatically.

Also Tesla’s navigation automatically adds charging stops for superchargers. You don’t have to do much thinking. Just drive the car (usually on autopilot on the freeway), follow the directions, and every few hours you’re at a charging station next to some restaurants, grocery stores, or pretty landmarks. The view from the charger at Twin Falls, Idaho is particularly beautiful.

Re: I visited over 120 EV chargers: why so many were broken

#59

Post by SkyPuncher »

I almost bought a KIA EV6 two weeks back.

The thing that stood out to me was the unreal amount of broken chargers. Tesla charger always seemed to work, but the non-Tesla chargers were broken or slow charging an amazing amount of the time.

* At the base level, it looked annoying. Repeating the charging process several times to find the "blessed" charger. You were lucky if the charger was actually labelled as broken.

* More seriously, the terrible condition of the major EV networks basically made it nearly impractical for a key long drive I need to do. If I wanted to do the trip on a single charging stop, I'd risk getting stranded at a broken fast charger, 50+ miles from the nearest working fast charger. If I stopped 50 miles earlier, I'd need a second stop no matter what. In winter conditions, it was unclear if I'd even be able to make the drive without 3 or 4 stops.

I'm extremely excited that NACS is coming to more vehicles. No only does it increase availability, but it drastically increases reliability. I'd feel comfortable doing that same drive on the Tesla network.

Re: I visited over 120 EV chargers: why so many were broken

#60

Post by [deleted] »

galangalalgol wrote: post #34
Qwertious wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The funny thing is that electrical charging isn't fully standardized, but somehow hydrocarbons are.

They aren't really, it is just that modern engines are incredibly tolerant of what you put in them. Some survey found that the different octane tanks get mis-filled a large portion of the time with other octanes or higher ethanol ratings. Even within an octane rating what is in there varies a lot. The changes needed to make a four stroke work on propane is very small. And an old diesel engine will run on almost any l…

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